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Sermon Discussion Questions 1 Title Sunday, November 24, 2024 Ungrateful Romans 1:18-23 Ungrateful 2 Overview Main Idea: Will you TRUST and THANK God when it is hard? Sermon Outline: 1) To he ungrateful...is to reject God 2) To he ungrateful...is to worship something else 3 Pre-Questions When life becomes challenging, what is your first response: to trust God, to question Him, or to look elsewhere for comfort? Why do you think that is? When life becomes challenging, what is your first response: to trust God, to question Him, or to look elsewhere for comfort? Why do you think that is? 4 Questions Verse Focus: Romans 1:21 – “For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened.” • How does failing to acknowledge God in gratitude lead to a spiritual drift, as described in this verse? • Read James 1:17, which says every good gift comes from God. How does remembering this truth help us combat an ungrateful heart? • Why is gratitude essential to maintaining a right relationship with God, especially when life is hard? Verse Focus: Romans 1:23 – “And exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.” • How does a lack of gratitude lead to idolatry or misplaced worship? What are some modern-day “idols” that people might worship instead of God? • Reflect on Exodus 20:3, “You shall have no other gods before me.” Why is God’s call to worship Him alone tied to trust and thankfulness? • In what ways can gratitude act as a safeguard against idolatry in your life? PDF Download

PODCAST That's a Good Question Saved By Grace: Understanding the Path to Our Salvation April 8, 2024 Jon Delger & Mitchell Leach Listen to this Episode Jon Oh hey everyone, welcome to That's a Good Question , a podcast of Peace Church and a part of Resound Media. You can find more great content for the Christian life and church leaders at resoundmedia.cc . That's a Good Question is a place where we answer questions about the Christian faith in plain language. Jon I'm Jon, I get to serve as a pastor. I'm here with Mitchell Leach, our producer. Mitchell So glad to be here. Jon And we are excited to answer some questions today, talking about the very basic core parts of our faith: how do you become saved? Can you lose your salvation? And some questions like that. Mitchell Yep. So, here's the first question. What do I have to do to be saved? Jon Yeah, great question. I think one of the very simple ways that Jesus talked about his mission on the earth, and I think it would be a great answer to this question: Mark 1:15, Jesus says, "Repent and believe the good news." I think that's the simplest answer to that question. Jon So, somebody's asking, so maybe they've heard some of the Christian teachings. How do I get this thing called salvation? How do I get eternal life, to be with God forever, to spend eternity with Jesus instead of apart from Jesus in hell? If that's the question you're asking, then let me explain those few words that I just said from Jesus in a few more words. We say that the Christian faith has some bad news and some good news. The bad news is that all human beings have sinned. Romans 3:23 says that all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. So all of us have fallen short of God's perfect standard of living exactly the way he calls us to. And the Bible calls that sin. And a few chapters later in Romans 6:23, the Bible says, "The wages of sin is death." So we've all done sin; none of us is perfect. We've sinned against God, and the punishment, the consequence, the wage of doing sin, is eternal death, what we call hell. So that's the bad news. But the good news of the gospel, the good news of Jesus, comes in the New Testament and tells us that if we put our faith in Jesus, all of our sins can be taken away. That somebody must die for our sins, but actually Jesus came to die as our substitute in our place, so that we don't have to suffer hell. Jesus suffered hell on the cross. If we call him our Lord, the King of our lives, and our Savior, and we say, "I can't save myself on my own, I admit that I've sinned, I'm sorry for my sin, and I trust Jesus to take all my sin away," then you can have eternal life. And that's how you become saved. John 3:16 is kind of the simplest explanation of how you gain that, how you get the gift of Jesus' salvation. You get it through faith: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son that whoever believes in him will not perish but will have eternal life." Mitchell So that's how we get salvation, by putting our faith in Jesus. Yeah, going off that, in Matthew 19, there's a man named the rich young ruler who asks Jesus this question, "Teacher, what good deed must I do to have eternal life?" Which is kind of interesting. Jesus's response: he asks him if he's followed the law, the Ten Commandments, some of the Ten Commandments, and he says, you know, I have. And it's almost a trick question when we hear, what do I have to do to be saved? Because the good news of the gospel is that Jesus has done it for us, right? When you're talking about Jesus being our substitute, we can answer the question, why am I a Christian, in the third person: that Jesus has paid for my sins. It's not on us, whether we've been baptized or whether we grew up in a Christian home. Those are things that we could do or that are on us. The good news is that Jesus has paid for our sin. It takes a weight off of your shoulders, at least thinking about being a Christian, there's a pressure for me that's taken off of my shoulders to be a Christian. Jon It's, yeah.Totally, totally. One of the pictures that Christians have classically painted is of us standing in front of God the judge at the end of our lives, and how does that courtroom scene play out? Sort of like God is asking, "Why should I let you into heaven?" And if I'm standing there before God answering that question, the answer is I don't point to anything that I've done. I point over to that guy; I point to Jesus and say, yeah, actually, everything that I've done means that I shouldn't be in heaven, I shouldn't receive eternal life. But what Jesus has done, that's why I will have eternal life. Yeah, if I can quote a creed, a statement that we've believed in Christianity that helps express our faith: this is from the Westminster Shorter Catechism, question 29: "How are we made partakers of redemption purchased by Jesus?" Mitchell It says, "We are made partakers of the redemption purchased by Jesus by the effectual application of it to us by his Holy Spirit." And really, what that means is what John 1:11 says: "He came to his own, to his own people, and his own people did not receive him, but to all who did receive him, to believe in his name, he gave the right to become children of God." It is something that is applied to us when he's called us and it's purchased by Jesus. Let's jump into the next question. One of my biggest fears is death: death of what happens next, it happening at any time and to whoever. How do we find comfort in death for those close to you? Yeah, my short answer would be by having the faith that we just talked about. You know, as you face what's going to happen after you pass out of this life, I mean, we can tell you, the Bible tells you what's going to happen after you pass out of this life. Jon You're going to receive judgment for your works. And without Jesus, that judgment lands us in hell, eternal death. Whereas if you have faith in Jesus, you're going to end up in eternal life. And so I think the key to answering the question is, how do I face death with peace, or how do I face death and not fear it? I think the key to answering that question is by knowing what's on the other side. If you know what's on the other side, then you can have peace. Christians have peace because we know that we're going to be with God. Mitchell I love questions like this because they're questions we've been asking since humans have been around. Jon Every human that's ever lived has asked that question. Yeah. If I can go back to another catechism question, this is one of our core foundational things. What is your only comfort in life and in death? Mitchell Yeah, the Heidelberg, this is the first question, and I love that. What is my only comfort in life and death? "That I, with body and soul, both in life and death, am not my own, but belong unto my faithful Savior, Jesus Christ." What a beautiful statement that our comfort in this is that we're not our own and we don't have to fear what's next. It's because we belong to Jesus, and when we pass away, we will be with him who is life, and so we will have life forever. That's a beautiful comfort, not just for us, but for those we know who have died and who believe. There's a great comfort in that. All right, let's jump into our next question. "Hello, hoping you can answer some questions on salvation." It looks like there's five questions here. So first, are we saved by faith alone? Second, do works play a role in salvation? Three, can we lose our salvation once saved? Four, how do we know we're saved? Five, why do Christian denominations have different answers to these very important questions of our eternity? Which one's right? Thank you for this opportunity. Well, you're welcome. John, let's jump into that first one: are we saved by faith alone? Jon Yeah, great question. And the second one was, "Are we saved by, or what role does works play?" right? So those are related: are we saved by faith alone, or are we saved by works? That's a classic question Christians have asked for a long time. Lots of passages we could point to, but one of the key passages for each of these questions is Ephesians 2, the first 10 verses of Ephesians 2. I won't read the whole thing, but I'll jump in. Let's see here, I'm gonna jump in at some point. Here's verse 8: "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God. Not a result of works, so that no one may boast." I think those couple of verses, verses 8 and 9 there, are really clear about the nature of where our salvation comes from. It's not by works, it's not your own doing. It's by grace through faith. So grace means it's a free gift, something you can't earn. Faith, we often say, is the instrument, it's how you receive the gift. You know, if somebody offers you a gift, you have to receive it somehow. If they just say, hey, I'm giving you a cherry red Ferrari, but they hold out the keys and you just walk away, well, you didn't actually receive the gift of the cherry red Ferrari. In the same way, Jesus offers to us salvation through his blood, but you have to put your faith in him as your Lord and Savior in order to receive that gift. And so it's by faith, it's not by works. We could talk about works do play an important role in the Christian life, but after you get saved. Yeah, absolutely Mitchell It's interesting because the Bible talks so much about being saved especially the New Testament, right? There's Romans 5 Romans 3 I mean I think even Romans 3 like in one verse for we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law Like there are answers there, but let me ask this question. Why would you say or why do people believe that we must do works in order to be saved? Yeah, a couple of reasons. The first one comes to mind is because it's the most natural thing to think. Jon That's how all of our other relationships work. Right. If you've got a relationship with somebody in whatever capacity, I mean, what you do, what you say, those things impact how that relationship happens, that work. We are judged based on our performance. That's just how the world works that we live in. It's by your works, it's by your performance. And so we would carry that over and think that that's the same way that we work with God, but it's not. Yeah, and it almost feels like in a world where we can't control things, Mitchell that's one way that we could control, right? My relationship with someone is based off of what I do. The bad news is we can't do enough good to be justified with God. Jon Right, for sure. I think it's a very attractive idea, at least at first glance, that I could control the situation by what I do. I mean, I think going into ancient paganism, the idea that if I do these things, then I will have a good harvest of crops. That's way more attractive than saying, well, it's up to the God of the universe whether we get rain or not rain, or whether we get hail, or a windstorm, or whatever happens, it's way more attractive to think, if I give these sacrifices and do these three things, then I will have a good harvest. That puts us in the driver's seat. We have control. Mitchell Yeah. I think, in some sense, maybe there's some left from pre-fall. Because before the fall, it was almost a covenant of works, is what we would call it. Jon It was based on, Adam could have stayed right with God if he would have obeyed. Mitchell But now that sin has entered the world, there's no way that we can do this. There's no way that we can be good enough to be justified in God, so that we can be right with God on our own merit. So for someone who's new to this, what would you say faith is? Yeah, good question. Usually when I'm answering this question, I try to give an illustration. Jon It's one that is not original to me. I heard it from somebody else but I think it's such a great picture of what faith is. I mean some of the words we could use is it's trust, it's putting your confidence or your hope in somebody else, it's a belief that's something true. I think all those things are the case. So here's one illustration that I think is excellent on what faith is. Once upon a time there was a guy who was a great tightrope walker, and he would walk back and forth on a tightrope over a waterfall, over an enormous chasm. If you fell, you would die or be seriously injured. He would go back and forth, and the crowds would applaud and be amazed by him walking back and forth on this tightrope. One time, he came to the edge and asked the crowd if they believed that he could carry a man on his back across the chasm. And everybody raised their hands and said, oh yeah, I believe you could do that. And he said, great, who wants to get on my back? And suddenly everybody's hand came down. And I think that's, to me, that's a great picture of faith in Jesus. Faith in Jesus would have been to then jump on his back. If you really believe it, if you really trust in that person and have full confidence in him, then you will get on his back. I mean, there's a lot of people out there that want to say, yeah, I think Jesus is great. I think church is great. I think Christianity could be good, but it's a different thing to say that I will no longer try to work for my salvation. I will not hedge my bet with any other religion or good works or giving of money. Not that some of those things are good things, but to try to hinge your salvation on those things. To say, I'm going to put all of my confidence, all of my faith that Jesus's death and resurrection brings me salvation. Mitchell To say, Jesus, you're my savior and you alone are my savior. I think that's faith in Jesus. Yeah. I think there's a difference between having full faith in what's going to save you versus having full confidence in what will save you rather than being 100% certain. Let me say it a different way. I think there's a difference between saying, Jesus is the only thing that I'm going to trust in, but I might be struggling with some doubts. Jon Yeah, so I'm not saying that you can't ever have doubts. My point is to say that you're not hedging your bet by saying, well, I'm gonna go to church, I'm gonna mostly believe in Jesus, but also I'm gonna work really hard and when I get to the end I'm gonna say, well, God, I was pretty good, and Jesus died for me. You know, there can't be any "and." You know, when you stand before God, why should I get into heaven? The answer has to be just Jesus. Mitchell Right. Tim Keller, at the end of his book, "The Reason for God," says something like, if you're falling off of a cliff, and there's a tree branch, if you have 100% certainty that it will save you,but never grab on, you die. But if you only have partial certainty that it'll save you and you grab on to it, you live. It's not the quantity of your faith, but it's the quality of who you have faith in, right? That Jesus is who you have faith in and he's able to save, which is a beautiful thing. Rather than saying, well, it's gonna be this and this. Jesus can't be an add-on to your salvation plan. What about question number two? Do works play any role in salvation? So I think we've said no, they don't play any role in salvation. Jon I'm going to go back to that Ephesians 2 passage I read, because verse 10, so we read verses 8 and 9, those talk about by grace you've been saved through faith, it's not your own doing, it's the gift of God, it's not a result of works, so nobody may boast. Here's verse 10, "For we are His workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them." Okay, so what the text is saying is that good works are important, but they come as a result of your salvation, not in order to earn your salvation. Christians do good works, not to earn something, but out of thankfulness, out of joy, out of love for God. Once you, you know, having faith in Jesus means that you now have a loving relationship with the Lord. You love Jesus. And if you love Jesus, you want to do what he says. Jesus says that himself, if you love me, you'll obey my commandments. Right? If you love Jesus, then you want to do what he says. And so good works flow out of a heart that's already got a relationship with Jesus. Mitchell Yeah, absolutely. You know, they talk about the idea of what is the root, right, versus what is the fruit? So what's the root of our salvation? It's that it's faith, right? And the fruit is the good works that comes from it versus saying, hey, you know what we must do is, you know, to be good is good works and then we can be saved. Yeah, it's an interesting thing. And yet there the Bible talks about them being really linked together and that can be confusing but it's the idea that faith without works is dead, not that we must do something in order to be saved, but that when we respond to the gospel, how we respond is by saying, I want to be so obedient that it is an actual, it is the evidence of our faith Jon Right. Well, so thinking about the root and the fruit analogy, I think of what James says about the relationship between faith and works. I think of what Jesus says in Matthew 7 about judging a tree by its fruit. So if a Christian does not produce the fruit of good works, then we do wonder if they are really saved. Just like when you look at a tree and you say, well, there's an apple tree, but it doesn't produce any apples. Well, then you sort of wonder, is it actually a healthy living apple tree? And the answer is no. I think a farmer would tell you that if an apple tree doesn't produce apples, it's not healthy. There's something wrong, maybe it's even dead. Yeah. And the same thing is true of a Christian. Again, the works don't save you, but if you don't have them, then maybe you don't actually have a relationship with Jesus. Yeah, there's an analogy that a pastor named John James uses, it's this idea of imagine there's a man in a prison under a sentence of death, right? Mitchell He's under the death penalty, and at the same time, he's terminally ill. He's got some sort of disease or he's, you know, really, really sick. If, you know, the government pardons him, it's not enough for him just to then be released. Like, he's going to end up dying from his illness. And at the same time, if he just gets healed, if he becomes free from his illness, well, he'll still go under the death penalty. He has to be both healed and pardoned. And there's part of that, that there is a link, almost a small link between those two. We can't just say, well, I said the sinner's prayer, and I'm going to go live my life however I want. There has to be this idea of the gospel transforming us at a fundamental, a really foundational level. Works are a sign in seeing that, man, we've fallen in love with who Jesus is, and we couldn't imagine spilling any more of his blood that was spilled for us on the cross. How about question number three? Can we lose our salvation once we are saved? Jon Great question. So, there are plenty of warning passages in the Bible that make it sound sort of like we could possibly lose our salvation. And I think those warnings are a lot to what we just said, that if you're not producing fruit, if you're not living a life that looks kind of like Jesus, that's producing the works that Jesus calls us to produce, then there is that question. Are you saved? And those passages are called the warning passages for that reason. They're meant to just sort of warn us, like, if you love Jesus, you will be walking in His ways. No, you're not going to be perfect, but you're going to be growing more and more into walking in His ways. And so, they just warn us, have you wandered off the path? But no, ultimately we would say, no, somebody can't lose their salvation. Some of the passages that I think of right away is I think of Romans 8:30, what's sometimes been called the golden chain, those whom he predestined, he also called, those whom he called, he also justified, those whom he justified, he also glorified. So to be justified is to be declared righteous. That's how we talk about the beginning of when you get saved. To be glorified is to enter into glory, which is when you either or Jesus returns. And so it links those two things. If you become justified, you become saved, then you will ultimately be glorified. You will be with Jesus. We'll be right back after this break. Mitchell Yeah, and that really lays out kind of the order of salvation. Maybe even going back to that first question, how are we saved? We see that we are elected or chosen before the foundation of the world, we are called, and then we are regenerated, we are justified, there's some sort of conversion, right? Then we are legally justified, we are adopted as sons sanctified, calling to be renewed, and then we are preserved at the end. We are, you know, that idea that he who began a good work will carry it to completion. And then we see at the end that glorification, our eternal state, we will be with God, which is cool. And it was something that I learned as I was studying for ordination, that order is so helpful for me to think about, of like, where are we at in this thing? And it's kind of weird to think, really, the last three are the ones that we probably experience the most, and yet there's nine of them. The first five happen without us even knowing it, just showing, again, the grace that God, He's done this before, or He's done this without us having to do anything. And then our response is just to say, we believe it and live it out. Yeah, it really shows that God's the one who's doing the work on us. Fourth question, how do we know we're saved? Jon Yeah, great question. I think one of the mistakes that Christians make in this is looking to ourselves instead of to our Savior. Yeah. I think a lot of people can look at themselves and say, well, I'm just not sure if I'm saved because I don't know if I have enough faith. Well, that's not really how Scripture talks about faith. It doesn't really talk about do you have enough? It talks about who is your faith in. And so the object of your faith is what is important. Yeah. So I think if you're asking like, okay, so if you've got faith in Jesus, you said, Jesus, you are my King, Jesus, I confess that I have sinned, I'm sorry for my sin, you have taken it on the cross. If you've got faith in Jesus, your Lord and Savior, and you're still doubting your salvation, then I think the place to go is to say, is to look at passages and just say, did Jesus die for my sin? That's right, he did. The sureness that Jesus died for your sin and rose on the third day. If that's true, then you have been saved. Mitchell Yeah. Is Jesus enough to pay for my sin? Right, that, you know, answer, or ask that question, is he enough? Thinking like, am I good? Even if I'm, you know, I know people who have questioned, saying, you know, I've really messed up recently. I don't even know if I'm saved. Well, it's not about what you've done. What you've done has been paid for, right? So we can't add anything to what Jesus has done. Yeah. How about this? This is the tricky one. Question number five. Why do Christian denominations have different answers to these questions? Which one is right? Jon That's an excellent question. So I heard it once that there's over 600 denominations in the U.S. That's pretty crazy. That's a wild number of different sets of beliefs and ways of doing things and stuff. So some of the denominational differences are actually very minor differences in beliefs. Some of them are more differences in tradition, in heritage, in more like practical sort of stuff. Mitchell Like governments, right? Jon Sure, yeah. Whether we vote or whether we don't. Sure, or even, you know, I think of like Reformed and Presbyterians, it's even, a lot of it comes down to, were you Dutch or were you Scottish, where does it start? You know, there's tons of similarity there, especially in theology. So there's that. I do, I just want to be honest, that it's true that there are some churches and groupsof churches that have wandered from the truth, that have wandered from the Bible. And so, you know, when you're looking at churches and denominations, you want to find ones that are faithful to the Bible, that's what you're looking for. There are things that I think are more gray areas in scripture. And so, you know, you could, there are different, different denominations that do things differently, but both can be faithful to the Bible. So, you know, some of it is that we're not perfect as humans. Some of that is the answer. That's why there's many different denominations. Some of it is that, because we're not perfect and because there are some areas that are a little bit gray in the Bible, that's why there's some different traditions about how to do things. The Bible is very clear there's false teachers, there are those who wander from the truth, there are those who want to lead others away from the truth. So that's one reason that there's different denominations. Specifically Mitchell around salvation, like how we are saved, right? Jon Yeah. In the New Testament Paul calls out people who say you must work in order to be saved. You must do certain things in order to be saved. So, yeah, there's good distinctions there. So I think I'm thinking of in the book of Acts when the apostle Paul is preaching to the Bereans, he calls them noble because the text says that everything that Paul preached to them, they went back to the Bible to see if that's what the Bible said. And so if you're asking the question, which denomination is right? Everybody's going to tell you it's theirs, but the real answer comes from the Bible. So you've got to do some hard work of reading the Bible and looking at what they're saying and compare them and just say, is that what this pastor is saying lining up with the Bible? And that's our job. Mitchell Yeah. And being willing to be so convicted that you'd stand before our judge, our eternal judge, and say, this is what the Bible says. You know, this is what I believe you are trying to tell us. I think in some sense, which one's right? Because of our sin, I could say, I don't think any of us are 100% right. Sure. That there are small areas where we might have it wrong, that we might have to confess one day before God to say, you know, I'm sorry that it was my sin that got in the way of understanding this perfectly. Yet, I feel like there is enough clarity in the Bible for us to know truly what is most important, how we must be saved, and then relying on the Holy Spirit to convict us of our sin and how we are supposed to interpret and understand the rest. Jon And one thing I do want to say is if you think that you're going to sit alone in your house with your Bible and watch somebody on a screen and try to decide if they're the right one or not. I do not do that. You need to get out, go to a church, sit under that preaching with your Bible, and think it through. And then when you have questions, you need to go to that pastor or some kind of leader in that church and say, please help me understand because I feel like what you're saying from the pulpit doesn't line up with what's in the Bible. Unfortunately, as a pastor, I've met several people, I'd say at least once a year I get this phone call or email, so-and-so has been looking for a church for the last 10 years, and they can't find any that are really faithful to the Bible. Well, sorry, I think you're making a mistake there. You can't sit alone in your basement, watch some YouTube preachers, and decide nobody's really faithful to the Bible and you're just going to continue to stay at home and watch different preachers. You need to go get involved in a church and try to figure it out. Mitchell Usually when you're convinced that everyone else is wrong, it might not be everyone else. Jon That's a fair point. Mitchell Unless you're Martin Luther, you know, you're the rare ones like that. But I think that that's a once-in-maybe-church-history kind of event. Jon Sure. Where only one person has got it right. And even then, it wasn't just one person. But usually if you think you're right and everyone else is wrong, that might be a you thing. I think that's a good observation. Hey, thanks so much for all of these questions. They have been really good questions about the gospel, the very core of the Christian faith, the good news of how you have life through Jesus. So hopefully this has been helpful to you. If these were your questions, if you have a friend who's asking these questions, I would encourage you to share this episode with them. Hopefully it's a helpful tool for them to think this through, or maybe you can even take some of the information you learned here, talk with them about the faith so that they can cross that line and have faith in Jesus and have life forever. Hope this is a really helpful resource to you. You can always ask more questions at peacechurch.cc /questions. Hope everybody has a great week. You can find That's A Good Question at resoundmedia.cc or wherever you listen to podcasts.

From Ketchup Stains to Salvation Christian Life Stephanie Delger Podcast Host Mom Guilt Podcast Published On: December 20, 2023 Does what I do really matter? How can picking up Cheerios off the floor for the third time today really make a difference in eternity? Being the mother to my four children is one of the best, hardest, and most rewarding things that I have done in my life. I know this, but if I’m honest, it doesn’t always feel that way. Housework Reflects the Gospel There is often a disconnect between what I know to be true and what I feel is true. I know that serving my family by cooking meals, washing, and folding the laundry are important. These are good things, important things that need to be done, especially since I don’t want my kids to be malnourished nudists running around the neighborhood. But when I am cleaning up yet another glass of spilled milk on the counter, I often find it hard to believe that this could have an eternal significance. Housework reflects the gospel. But what if God has designed us to be lights in a dark world not by doing extraordinary things, but by doing the mundane, ordinary things that point to an extraordinary God? What if through these seemingly boring, unimportant tasks, we were able to show our families how God loves them? What if doing the laundry, cooking food, and cleaning up the toy room show our children in a concrete tangible way who the Lord is and what He has done for them? What if the ordinary things point them to their Savior? What if all these things are an everyday reminder of the gospel? Gospel Work In The Laundry Laundry has to be my least favorite household chore. Not only is it time-consuming, but unless you are doing laundry while everyone runs around naked, you are never done with it. At the end of a full day of laundry, everyone has to change into their pajamas and BAM! More laundry in the hampers. Someone once pointed out to me that if Adam and Eve never ate the fruit from the tree in the Garden, we wouldn’t have laundry. It was only after Adam and Eve sinned that they realized they were naked! Laundry is a direct result of the fall! (Can I get an Amen?) Some of you may really enjoy doing laundry, and if that’s you, can we please be friends and you can come over to my house and do mine anytime you would like? A few weeks ago I took both my girls out clothes shopping and they bought some much-needed warm clothes for winter. They were so excited to wear them. They changed into them as soon as they could. They sat down to eat dinner and within the first few bites, one of them had a huge glob of ketchup dribbled all down the front of their cream-colored shirt. She started frantically scrubbing the ketchup trying to get it off, as I just told her to be careful because ketchup stains. I had her take the shirt off and walked to the laundry room to start the stain removal process to try and get the bright red condiment off her not-so-white-anymore shirt. Thankfully, the ketchup stain came out and I was able to present her with a beautifully clean shirt. My daughter didn’t mean to spill ketchup on her brand-new shirt, but when she did, what did she do? She tried to handle it herself which only made the problem worse. Isn’t that what we often do with God our Father? We sin, and rather than immediately asking for help, we try to clean it up ourselves. We try to hide our sin from others and from God. It’s only when all our attempts have failed, that we ask for help. And God is there for us! God takes our dirty, ketchup-stained lives, and through the blood of Jesus, restores us to Himself. When I brought the now clean shirt to my daughter, I was showing her what God has done for her (and me!). 1 John 1:9 says “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” In doing laundry, in taking something that was stained and dirty and making it clean, we can tangibly show our kids what God has done for them on the cross. Jesus, on the cross, took the wrath that we deserved and gave us his righteousness. It is only by what Jesus did on the cross that we and our families can be saved. Jesus promises that if we put our faith in Him alone for our salvation, He will cleanse us from all unrighteousness. We can reflect this truth in something as simple as wiping away ketchup stains from a shirt! Gospel Work In Cooking How many moms have spent sometimes hours preparing a meal for their children and when they set the dish in front of them, are met with a look of disgust? A battle usually ensues at my house over how much they need to eat to get down from the table. After the meal, I scrape a decent amount of food from their plate into the trash thinking, “Why do I do this? Does it really even matter?” My dear husband has consoled me many nights because it is so frustrating to spend all this time and energy making food that just ends up in the trash. How can this routine which happens at least three times a day really matter in eternity? When we provide food and nourish our families, we can show them how God our Father provides for us and nourishes us. In the Old Testament, God provided for his people in the desert by giving them manna and bread. The Israelites thought that their biggest problem was hunger. However, they had a much deeper problem, a heart full of sin. God is so gracious and He provided them with food to quench their physical hunger, while also promising them something greater to come. The Israelites had a physical and spiritual problem. When Jesus was in the Upper Room with his disciples hours before he was betrayed, tortured, and crucified, Luke 22:19 says, “And he (Jesus) took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body, which is given for you.” God provides. God provided for His people with manna, but He provides for our spiritual needs through Christ. When preparing yet another peanut butter and jelly sandwich for our kids, what if we do this, reminding ourselves and our kids how all our needs are ultimately provided for us by Christ? Gospel Work In Organizing I don’t know about your house, but at my house, there are usually toys everywhere. It usually only takes one well-placed Lego left on the floor to be stepped on by me, before I lose my cool and yell “Enough! We don’t live in a barn, please clean up this room!” So we all spend the next thirty minutes to an hour cleaning up the room. I walk out to tackle the next task, and when I return to the room again, much to my dismay, it looks like we never cleaned it in the first place! I am tempted to throw in the towel and call it quits. What is the point of cleaning when it just gets messy again a few minutes after walking out of the room? I am so glad that God doesn’t look at my life this way, aren’t you? Paul, in Ephesians 2:4-5 , writes that we have sinned and were God’s enemies, “But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ.” When we’re messy and dead in our sins, the Bible tells us that God loves us, forgives us, and brings us into a relationship with Himself. God does this again and again. When a person becomes saved, they have the Holy Spirit which comes to dwell inside them. Because of God, we have the ability and strength to fight sin in our lives. But as much as we want to, we still sin. We still need forgiveness. And just like a messy room that gets picked up again and again, God doesn’t quit on us. He doesn’t throw in the towel and decide that we are no longer worth saving. God continues to work in a believer’s life, sanctifying us. Praise God! Housework For The Glory of God Jesus often told parables to his followers to help them understand biblical truths. Jesus could have chosen to simply tell them in a lecture-style format truths about God and His Kingdom. But rather than simply give a lecture, he told them stories. We are wired to love stories. They help us identify deeply with what is being taught. Stories can bring our hearts and minds to worship in a way that spoken words alone cannot. What if we started treating housework as parables, which point both our hearts and our family’s hearts and minds towards the gospel? As we do the dishes, we think about God cleansing our hearts from sin. As we change yet another dirty diaper, we can recall from Isaiah 64, that our good works presented towards God with a bad heart posture, are like giving him this dirty diaper. As our newborn baby or toddler cries for milk, so too should we yearn for spiritual nourishment. ( Psalm 84:2 ) Having something tangible, something right in front of us, makes these truths hit a deeper way. God in his goodness, gives us real-life, everyday activities that can bring us closer to Him. Recalling all that God has done for us while doing everyday housework, is a way that we can live out Colossians 3:17 which says, “Whatever you do, in word or deed, do everything in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.” Whatever you do, do it in the name of the Lord Jesus, recalling who God is, and what He has done, remembering all the blessings that He has given you, and giving thanks to God the Father. Housework Models Jesus’ Servanthood While we serve our families, we can also model for them how Jesus served. The Bible says that Jesus came to serve others, not to be served. ( Matthew 20:28 ) If anyone in all of history had the right to be served and waited on, wasn’t that person Jesus? He is the Son of God, God incarnate. Yet this is the opposite of how Jesus thought and acted. Jesus took on flesh and came to earth as a human baby, covered in blood and bodily fluids. He spent his first night not sleeping on a comfortable crib mattress, but in a manger, filled with scratchy straw. Jesus spent his time not seated on a throne, but healing the sick and eating with the social outcasts. On the night of his betrayal, we see him get on his hands and knees and scrub the dirty, stinky feet of his disciples. This includes the disciple who would in a few hours betray him with a kiss. Jesus exemplifies what it means to love and serve others. Philippians 2:3-8 says, “Do nothing from selfish ambition or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves. Let each of you look not only to his own interests but also to the interests of others. Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.” God invites us into a life of servanthood which not only gives God glory but brings our families closer to Him. So as you clean yet another sink full of dirty dishes, you can do this as an act of worship. Worship the Lord for what He has done for you and your family, all while showing your children how much you love them, just as your Heavenly Father loves you. More Blogs You'll Like Is Prioritizing Love Un-Christian? What Does The Bible Say? Read More More Than Meets the Eye Discovering God’s Purposes for Motherhood Read More Mom Guilt and How to Fight It Read More

PODCAST That's a Good Question Divine Inspiration: Unveiling the Origins and Authors of Scripture April 14, 2024 Jon Delger & Logan Bailey Listen to this Episode Oh hey everyone, welcome to That's a Good Question , a podcast of Peace Church and a part of Resound Media. You can find more great content for the Christian life and church leaders at resoundmedia.cc . That's a Good Question is a place where we answer questions about the Christian faith in plain language. I'm John. I get to serve as a pastor at Peace Church as well as a part of this show. You can always submit questions at peacechurch.cc/questions . And today I'm here with Pastor Logan. Howdy. And Mitch, our producer. Hey everybody. And we got some great questions today about how the Bible all came together. Here's our first question for today: "I'd be interested in additional resources to understand how the scriptures were put together or canonization. I've read some stuff over the years, but it was mostly about how well-documented the history was and the significant number of consistent manuscripts. But when a group sat down and chose what to include, what not to include, and in what order to include it in, how was that done? What criteria was there?" I really like this question. I like how this questioner actually said a lot of things that I hope all the listeners understand and can assume as well, is that we use the word canonization to talk about the canon of scripture, the 66 books of canon that we have in scripture. What's a canon? That's a wonderful question. Mitchell, the producer with a computer. A loose canon. Could you look up a technical definition of what we mean when we say canon? Oh, I thought you were calling me a canon. Like a loose cannon. What we call the canon of scripture would be the 66 books that we recognize as inspired word of God. There are other books that you could consider as Jewish literature or early church literature that we don't see as part of the canon of scripture. They're nice books to read. You can go read the book of Tobit. It's in what we call the Apocrypha. It's Jewish literature, but we wouldn't consider it inerrant, infallible scripture. So yeah, is there a definition of canon? Yeah, from the Oxford Dictionary, it says, "a general rule, law, principle, or criterion by which something is judged." Yeah, the standard of what scripture is. Yeah, the law, I liked that word there too. Yeah, I think it's nice that they recognize that term and way of viewing it. I also liked this sentence, "I've read some stuff over the years, but it mostly was about how well-documented the history was and the significant number of consistent manuscripts that we have for scripture." Those are two huge points I just don't want to skip over. The Bible is the most well-attested historical ancient document in existence by miles. It's laughable to consider that what we have as far as the Old and New Testament isn't accurate; it's the most accurate ancient document in existence by far. And then also in line with that, the significant number of consistent manuscripts, we have an incredible amount of manuscripts for both the Old and New Testament in various books, in different languages. If you do any ancient language study or an ancient document study, it's incredible. Yeah, how credible the documents are. Yeah, and if you're going out to look to find those types of resources, there are plenty of them. I've got three or four books that could help spell those answers out. But specifically, I think they're trying to figure out how do we understand how the Bible was put together, really? Was it just a bunch of guys sitting in a room deciding this? I think that there are some common myths about this. I'd love to talk about those, maybe part of the reason why this was asked. I think one of the myths is that a bunch of guys sat down in a room and picked out which books are the Bible. That's a great point. Like I mentioned the book of Tobit. It's a book that we do not consider a part of the canon of scripture. It's what we would call the Apocrypha. It's other books of Jewish literature that we don't recognize as a part of the canon. Yeah, you won't find it in our Bibles. That's a great example and other books like it of like, well, who decided that this wasn't? And who decided that Jude was or James was? That sort of thing. So this, yeah, I think it's a great question. So why isn't Tobit part of the Bible? Well, let's talk about exactly what you just said: what are the parameters that all of the books in the Bible share and what are the things that a book like Tobit doesn't have? Yeah. Actually I'll let you go. There's one very helpful thing I think of. Do you want to read that? I do, but no, we're gonna come back to that. We've got a crazy assertion that somebody made that we'll come back to. But the first thing I wanted to say was I think it is a myth to think that how we got the Bible today was just a matter of a bunch of guys sitting in a room and choosing this one or that one. Now eventually church councils did come to the place where they had to say these are the 66 books of the canon, but what they were really doing is recognizing something that was already true at that point. They weren't deciding. They were just recognizing this is what the church has been doing now for quite a while. You go back to even the New Testament period itself, and you've got Peter talking about how Paul's books, assuming they are scripture, are really hard to understand. You've got interplay between the New Testament books, already talking about the Gospels, talking about Luke's Gospel. So the New Testament writers themselves in the first 50 years after Jesus' life and ministry are already seeing each other's writings as part of scripture. And part of the really helpful thing is what you said: it's not them choosing, it's not them deciding, it's them recognizing this was inspired by the Holy Spirit. God meant this to be used for worship in our worship gatherings, to be seen as authoritative in the lives of a Christian. And so it's a recognition that God has inspired this document. And there are those that we would say are not inspired to that level of "should be used in worship." And the recognition is this has been used for Christians to worship God and to be an authority in our lives. So that's the really helpful thing, seeing it as a recognition, not a decision being made. So what are the—real quick, just for the sake of—this is one of those things that I think it's really good for most Christians to maybe just kind of know these basic four things off the top of their heads. What are the four marks that make a book a part of the Bible? Apostolic origin would be one of them, saying that these books need to have their basis in an apostle. Someone who saw Jesus, learned from Jesus, was commissioned by Jesus, or read by an apostle or the source is an apostle. You have Matthew and John, who are apostles of Jesus, disciples of Jesus, following Jesus, and then apostles in the church. Then you have Mark and Luke, who weren't apostles, but had a source with an apostle, whether it be Peter or Paul. The origin goes back to apostles, right? Peter did an extensive search into the story of Christ and went back to the apostles or eyewitness accounts. The second one would be universal acceptance, commonly used, affirmed by many churches in the first century. By the time we get to the 300s AD, when church councils are solidifying this, one of the marks that they use is: has it been universally accepted for the last two or three hundred years? Were the church fathers quoting it as authoritative? Absolutely. The third would be liturgical use. Is this helpful for the liturgy of the church or is it helpful for worship within the church? Four would be consistent doctrine. Does the doctrine in these books fit with the rest of what we consider to be scripture? I've told people this: one of the things that has always helped me when I have any seasons of doubt or deep questions that I'm looking for answers to, is the severe consistency within scripture. Just the radical consistency and comprehensive nature of how one book was written hundreds of years prior to another book by a totally different person across the world from each other, and yet there's this incredible amount of consistency in doctrine and the vision of the world that they have. So, well, real quick, I just want to—we just talked through the four marks real quick. So again, I said I think it's really good for Christians just to kind of know these off the top of their head a little bit. I think it's just one of those good things to remember. So again, the four marks are it was either written by or connected to an apostle. It was universally accepted among the churches in that first early church period, the first century after the church. It was used in worship in churches. And fourth, it's consistent in doctrine. So I think just that's worth kind of remembering. Those are the four marks. That's why we, that's how we look at the books of the Bible and kind of evaluate them. We're recognizing those things. And there are valuable documents that God's people have produced and can produce that are still good. They're just not necessarily those four things as inspired by scripture. Maybe hit all three of the four, right? But we just, you know, it has to hit the four, all four to be considered. So you could say the books in the Apocrypha, which the Roman Catholic Church, and I believe Eastern Orthodox Church, would say these are a second canon. We wouldn't recognize them as a second canon because they wouldn't be hitting all four of those marks. Those are books that were written by God's people in the past that are good stories, maybe historical accounts that we just wouldn't see as completely inerrant. Valuable to read, but not inerrant, not authoritative. And then you could look at, for the New Testament, you have things like the Didache, like an early church document that was written talking about how early churches, how their liturgical services went, different guidance in a Christian's life, and we see those as valuable, but they don't hit those four marks. And they weren't universally used. I guess you could go through the list, but valuable, not those four things, not scripture. Yeah. So getting back to this question, how did this get put together? I mean, I think a common understanding is that a group of guys got together. I think one of the most common understandings is that we put together the New Testament at the Council of Nicaea, and there's a lot of kind of mystery, or there's maybe some questionable motives that people throw into that. And so what would be your response to something like that, that the Bible was put together kind of under scrupulous circumstances? And you're saying that it was politically motivated and things like that. Yeah, I mean, that's, I think, one of the criticisms of this. That somehow Constantine edited the manuscripts in his original languages and then also went back and edited all the manuscripts in Latin and Syriac and Coptic and somehow managed to change the text. Yeah. Yeah. What would you guys say to that when you hear that? That's where I just stick to the refrain that no, the church councils in the 300s are just recognizing what was already true. They're just using those four marks and reflecting on the last couple hundred years of the church and saying, yeah, this has already been true. We're just going to write it down and solidify it in a church council. Yeah. And I think solid, universal, used in worship, and consistent in doctrine. I think an important part, too, is that the Council of Nicaea did not touch the canon of scripture at all. Totally. Right. So they couldn't have. You go back and look at the notes, and what they talked about was the person of Jesus. Yeah. It wasn't until later councils that we talked about any sort of canon. Yeah, that theory I think is so baseless just because of the impossibility of that's 300 years of church history had it happened. It's longer than America has been a country. The amount of manuscripts that were produced in that timeframe is ridiculous to think that they could have... So along those lines... ...changed things. Let me read—here's a couple sentences written by a popular, a very popular Christian author, a very influential person. Who has some bad ideas. Yeah, who has some not-so-good ideas. So let me just read this and add to the conversation. So he says, "Supporting our faith with 'the Bible says'"—in quotes, quote-unquote, "'the Bible says'"—"communicates the foundation of our faith is the Bible." I would say it is. We'll keep going. "As we've discovered, it's not. Not unless there weren't any Christians until after the Bible was assembled in the fourth century. 'The Bible says,'" quote-unquote, "insinuates that the roots of our faith go no deeper than the fourth-century decision to combine first-century documents with the Jewish scriptures." Yeah, so to summarize, his critique is saying that we as Christians shouldn't say as a basis for our faith, "Well, the Bible says it." Right. And he's saying that isn't valid because the Bible wasn't put together until 400 years after Jesus was. He's depending on that faulty theory that prior to the fourth century, there wasn't consensus on what scripture was. Yeah. I think there's conversations going on because once that council happened, there was a much more kind of authoritative voice on the list. But the list was recognized and put together because they're saying, hey, we were recognizing these 66 books as set apart, as holy, as different because of those four parameters. Yeah, I think if we're going to be charitable at all, in its form today with the 27 books in the New Testament, it wasn't really solidified until about 400 years after. You know, about 367, there was a letter that went out by Athanasius on Easter, not canonizing, but really offering the first complete set of books. But that would be to say, and that's kind of where the charity runs out, but that would be to say that there wasn't scripture before that. And I think that's where this is a little bit silly. There being consensus across the globe of Christians, of the list, especially at a time where there wasn't necessarily Crossway and Zondervan publishing well-bound 66 books, right? Their being consensus is different than there being scripture at all. That the Lord has inspired words of men to be infallible and inherent, and those four things, apostolic, Christians reading that, using it in worship, it being beautifully consistent within itself. Scripture existed ever since God spoke through men and inspired. Let me pull up the verse just because one thing we would say about scripture is that it's self-attesting. It's not to mention that you've got the Old Testament. Yeah, exactly. Long before this. Second Timothy 3:16, "All scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work." According to that author we read, he would have us believe that faulty assumption that there wasn't a God-breathed scripture profitable for all these things, for the man of God to be complete and equipped for every good work, until the Council of Nicaea, which is ridiculous. Yeah, I think one of the things that the question asker—I'd love to connect the dots just a little bit. So they say, you know, "I want to know more about why these books were put together, but all I can find is just that there were lots of books or there were lots of manuscripts" and all that kind of stuff. I think that is in itself a way to attest to the fact that scripture was around in the first century, that there were all of these letters being passed on, copied and passed on, copied, because we recognize them as scripture. And so there are books floating around the Mediterranean that we recognize as scripture early on. I mean, one of the cool things about the Bible's history is we can find things like the Ryland fragment that was found in Alexandria, Egypt. It's like a piece of paper the size of your hand from the book of John. Right. And it carbon dates to 100 AD, or yeah, 100 AD. And it was wrapped on a mummy. It was thrown away. It had already been copied. And so it traveled from where John was in Ephesus, or right outside of Ephesus, all the way down to Alexandria, Egypt, and used and discarded to be put on a mummy by 180, which is kind of crazy. It's unprecedented. The Bible was being circulated. Scripture was being circulated. It wasn't until 400 years, or 367, that they put it all together in one place. Yeah, do we want to mention any resources that they could read? Yeah, you mentioned you have a few books. Why don't you mention one, and then let's go to the next question. One of the books that I found that's really good is called Scribes and Scripture by John Mead and Peter Gurry. It's published by Crossway. It's actually one of my former professors from Phoenix Seminary. Awesome book. I stole a lot of content for this podcast from it, but it would be a great one to see, and we'll put that in the show notes for people if they want to look it up. I think just as a more readable one, Can We Trust the Gospels by Peter Williams. Yeah, great book. It would be great. So just to connect the dots to repeat the question, we have the early manuscripts, well-attested, tons of them, very reliable historical documents, but how do we get the list of 66? And the answer is it was recognized early on because of its connection. Each book is a connection to an apostle, universally recognized, used in worship services, and consistent Orthodox doctrine within itself across the 66 books. Yeah. All right, let's jump into the second question. In the Old Testament, there are texts that record what the enemy of God's people said, even though no one from the Israelites would have heard them, and they give some examples here. How did the authors of the Bible know what they said if they weren't there? It's a wonderful question. I read that and paused for a second and thought, this is a good question. That's this whole podcast. That's right. That's a good question. We'll be right back after this break. Hi, I'm Elizabeth, one of the co-hosts of MomGuilt, a podcast with new episodes every Monday. Mom Guilt is a podcast about the daily struggles in motherhood. Stephanie and I share real experiences of mom guilt and how we have found freedom from that guilt through the gospel. Listen to us on resoundmedia.cc or wherever you find podcasts. I think it's similar to, you know, did Moses write, "and Moses was the humblest man on the face of the earth?" You know, I think it's similar to some of those questions. We've got parts of the Bible or about people recording their own deaths. You know, we know the first five books of the Old Testament were compiled by Moses, but there are parts that we look at and say, Moses couldn't have written that himself. Unless he was a ghost. We do not think that Moses died and then came back and wrote. You are right. Thanks for saying. We don't believe that. Yeah, so I think it points to the idea of editors and some fact-collecting, and maybe even what you call very early journalism, going on back in the day of going back and getting some witnesses and asking questions, and that's a great point. I think Moses's example is good. Moses wrote the Pentateuch, and then at the end of it, it says that Moses died. Clearly, Moses didn't write that. You said editor is a word we would use. Someone came back, trusted it within the community that wrote that. We also have examples within Paul's letters where Paul is speaking and someone's writing for him, and there's times where someone will actually say that person's name. I don't have a reference on top of my head, but we have moments where frequently Paul says, I write this with my own hand, or I, Paul, at the end of a letter, meaning, well, that part he wrote with his own hand. And the rest of it he was saying, and someone was writing as he was speaking. Yeah, Siri. Here we go. A transcriber. They brought up the idea of 1 Samuel 5 when the Ark was captured by the Philistines and brought back because it had caused some pretty bad, bad real-life consequences, I would say, of stealing something like that. I think you... Which is where John said some journalism going on. There are editors, transcribers, and some journalism going on. There's oral tradition going on, and they're writing down what's being spoken about. We also have to understand that Old Testament Israel was not like America. It wasn't as big as America. It would be a smaller size. So when someone would take something like that and a phenomenon like this would happen, where they steal an ark and then all these supernatural things happen, word would spread. That's how news spread, through word. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So when we look at ancient Near East texts, we wouldn't say it has to meet our standard of journalism today. We need to have an eyewitness, like oral tradition, with a citation. Correct. Back then, oral tradition was a legitimate form of literature. I mean, in any old literature, we would say that that is legitimate, not just legitimate, but it is authoritative. We would say that this is credible. That's the word I was looking for. That's a much better word. No, I think that's true. Oral tradition is a credible source for this. And there is, underneath scripture, there is an oral tradition of how did that get to that person, and how did Moses write this, or how did it? And it was because news was spreading. People were talking about these things. So the writer of this book didn't have to be there to hear these people say, oh, I got tumors from the Ark. And that's what we mean when we say there's some journalism going on. They are writing what is being attested through the oral stories and sharing. And that's OK. It doesn't take away from inerrancy at all. Right. Let's jump into the third question. This is a great one. Why are the books of the Bible ordered in the way that they are? For example, Nehemiah and the return to Jerusalem is before many of the accounts of the capture of Jerusalem. This is a good question too. Yeah, totally. Yeah, so going back to the Old Testament, I mean, the Jewish canon was the law, the prophets, and the writings, right? So that's the order they had it in. So you had the first five books of the Old Testament, and then the prophets, which was what we know today as the prophets, as well as some of the historical books. And then you had the writings, which is what we would call the wisdom literature, plus Ezra and Nehemiah. Was Ezra and Nehemiah part of the wisdom? Yeah. That would be a more Jewish traditional way of organizing scripture in the Old Testament. And then there's some Christian traditions that would categorize it by Pentateuch, history, poetry, and prophets. So there's different opinions at different times of, well, how do you categorize these things? Because, again, these are loose documents. They're not bound into one book necessarily. They're scrolls. There's a papyri or whatever that are just kind of out and about, and people would be like, "Hey, read me the letter of James," and then grab the letter of James and read it. We don't even have verse references for the Bible until the 1500s. So they're ordered differently. Those are not inspired, by the way. I don't know how many people actually know that. Yeah, that's a great point. No, legitimately. It's the same with the order. Yeah, the order of the books, and the verse numbers, and the chapter numbers. Those are not inspired. They're helpful. That came much later. Yeah, they're helpful. They're added, and they're organized in a certain way. But yeah, the inspired word is what was originally written. And then the order we put it in and the verse references that we add to it, they sometimes vary. And it's because they are not the inspired thing. The inspired thing is the original words that are written. Yeah, so if your pastor is preaching through something and he stops with, you know, chapter 3, verse 15a, that's okay. Or it's really bad proof texting. That's either one or the other. No, I'm just kidding. But it's okay. Well, I do sometimes appreciate when someone says, how come you didn't read to the end of the chapter, or how come you picked a passage that's half on one chapter and half in the other? Or in one verse, right? Yeah, it's because those verse numbers and chapter numbers, like you said, were added, and they're helpful, but they don't necessarily break up the text in the way that is right. I mean, Paul's letters were ought to be read in one read-through. Yeah. I mean, who wants to sit down and just listen to the book of Romans be read through once? But that was what it was meant to be. It's just, let's listen to what Paul said to the Roman church. Yeah. We're the Roman church. Read the whole book. Logan, if you read it to me, I'd sit down and listen to it any day. I love it. So that ordering can be different, and the reason being, there's a reason behind it, like the later Christian tradition or the earlier Jewish tradition, the three categories of the four. The way I've always thought of the reason that we order it the way we do in our tradition is just because it's the historical account, and then everything flows out of that. It's basically the history and the interpretation. Yeah, yeah. That's the way I thought of it. Yeah, I mean, the major prophets and the minor prophets are not because the minor prophets were not ready for the big ones. Smaller, yeah, not ready. They're smaller books. Right, well, and in the Old Testament, the prophets are really the interpretation of the history of what's happened in the first five books of the Old Testament as well as in the history books. It's a reflection on that, it's a looking forward on it, it's an application of that, just interpreting the meaning behind all that's happening. Same thing with the New Testament letters, it's interpreting the meaning of Jesus' life, death, and resurrection. I think too, like we're planning on studying Kings for the men's and women's Bible studies in the fall, and Kings, I mean, traditionally it's seen as kings, the book of kings. And we've gone back and we've said, well, there's first kings and second kings, just because if we don't do that, it's a really big book. Well, it was also how they broke it up because they ran out of scroll. Exactly. That's a great point. Yeah. All on one scroll. Yeah. And it's the same for Samuel. We have first and second Samuel, but it's just Samuel. Any Old Testament book where there's first and second, it's because they couldn't fit on one strong long piece of paper. Yep. Yeah. Well, hey, these are some great questions, really good practical questions, just about how the Bible came together and how we engage with it now. So hey, thanks everybody for asking. Thanks for listening. So hey, thanks everybody for asking. Thanks for listening. Tune in next time. That's a Good Question at resoundmedia.cc or wherever you listen to podcasts.

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Parable of the Two Sons Sermon Series: Religion vs Relationship Ryan DB Kimmel Lead Pastor Peace Church Main Passage: Matthew 21:28-32 Transcript Today is the day the Lord has made. So let us rejoice and be glad in it and you all best rejoice. So let me hear you say, Amen. Amen. So who here agrees with this statement? There is beauty in the simple things. You agree with that? I completely agree with that. One thing is so true for our world is that we over complicate things but there is such beauty in the simple things and listen I know that I'm the lead pastor of a large fast-paced multi-site multi-million dollar church that just went through a huge capital campaign but I'm just tearing out my heart the heart of my heart is for the simple things at the end of the day I want simple. And I think this is part of why I love Jesus so much. He was the undisputed master of showing the beauty in simple things. He was the master about showing the power in the simple things. And this is what he does through the parables. Parables are little story analogies that are told simply, but yet reveal so much power and beauty. Last week we looked at the parable of the prodigal son. Pastor John brought us through that about the two brothers and today we're going to be looking at another parable about two brothers. The other parable of the two sons, the two brothers. If you have your Bibles, would you please turn to Matthew 21. We'll be looking at verses starting at verse 28. So as you're turning there in your Bibles, Jesus gives us this little parable to highlight and to challenge us what it means to believe in God versus actually following God. Jesus gives us this parable to help us to identify if our religious obedience is matched with a true love for the Father. And that's been our sermon series, this quick little two-week sermon series, Religion or Relationship – What Actually is the Christian Faith? faith. So in this story that we're going to read, it's a parable, and what's interesting, here's what you need to know, is that Jesus told this parable in the temple days before his crucifixion. He was in Jerusalem and people had gathered in this time to celebrate Passover. Passover was a Jewish celebration. Now listen, during Passover, Jerusalem could swell to six times its normal size. So it was incredibly packed as people from all over would come to celebrate this religious festival. And now what Passover did is it commemorates God's saving work in bringing the Hebrews out of Egypt. Now, I think what's very interesting is that Jesus gives this parable during a highly religious observance. It's almost as if he's making them think about whether or not they're coming to celebrate Passover out of religious duty or out of love for God. And I'll just let the cat out of the bag right now. Same goes for you here. Are you coming to church out of religious duty or out of love for God? And so let's let Jesus encourage us and challenge us here this morning. With this, would you hear the word of our Lord? Matthew 21:28-32. This is God's word. Jesus says, Matthew 21:28-32 28 “What do you think? A man had two sons. And he went to the first and said, ‘Son, go and work in the vineyard today.’ 29 And he answered, ‘I will not,’ but afterward he changed his mind and went. 30 And he went to the other son and said the same. And he answered, ‘I go, sir,’ but did not go. 31 Which of the two did the will of his father?” They said, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “Truly, I say to you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the kingdom of God before you. 32 For John came to you in the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes believed him. And even when you saw it, you did not afterward change your minds and believe him. This is God's word. Let's pray. We'll continue. Let's pray. Father God, the fact that you have revealed yourself as our father shows the kind of relationship you want to have with us, oh God. And so I pray, Father, here in the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus, by the fellowship and power of the Holy Spirit, that you would help us to see how our faith is more than just a religion. It is a relationship that we have with you, our living God. And it's in your name we pray these things. Amen. Amen. So, church, as we look at this little story here today, I want to give you the main idea. I want you to chew on this one for a little bit. You have a relationship with God. You have a relationship with God when you obey the Will of God. Now, as we look at this little parable, there's a couple things we're going to pull out and discuss as we chew on this here this morning. So here's here's kind of your outline. We have a relationship with God when we obey the will of God as seen in the contrast of the two brothers. The contrast of the two brothers (vv. 28-31) The challenge of the religious leaders (vv. 31-32) 1. The contrast of the two brothers So with the crowd listening and with the religious leaders listening, here's what Jesus says. And I love how he starts out. Now imagine as he's sharing this story here, I'm just going to imagine those religious leaders, just their smug looks on their face, dressed all nice, this air of superiority. And Jesus just comes and he just delivers, just the powerhouse of a parable. He's going to go for the mic drop here, because if actually, if you read earlier, Jesus has already challenged him. He's already put them in their place. And now he kind of just, he goes for the final nail in the coffin. I love how he starts. He says, what do you think? He's like, what do you think here, boys? And then he tells this story. He says, so this dad has a farm and his dad has two sons who are brothers. And he says to the one son, Hey, go out and do your chores. And that son says, no, I don't know about you. I was not allowed to say no to my dad. He says no. But then afterwards he, he goes and changes his mind and he does it. No, no. It says, Jesus says that he changed his mind. The son changed his mind. We'll come back to that. Well, this farmer dad has another son and he says, okay, boy, you go do your chores now. And this little brown-nosing son says, yes, daddy, sure, daddy, I'll go do it, daddy, right away, daddy. But then does not actually do this. Now, here's what I can tell you right now. Here's what I'm willing to bet that I know about you right now. You already kind of like the first son, and you're already really annoyed with the second son. And I'll tell you now, it was probably the same for the crowd when they heard it back in Jesus' day. But I love how Jesus frames the question. So he tells the story, and then this is how he wants them to think about it. He says, which of the two, verse 31, which of the two did the will of his father? He's saying which one proved that he actually respected his dad. Now, hopefully you know this, but this story is clearly meant to teach us about us and God. And I'll just say one of the first things we see right off the bat is that you don't have to be perfect to have a relationship with God. But we do have to obey his will. The whole point here is that Jesus is concerned about which son actually obeys his dad. Notice, notice Jesus does not ask which son loved his dad more. Jesus asked that in a way that's proven by their actions because what's truly in our hearts is shown in our actions. What's truly is in our hearts is shown in the way that we live. I'm not saying we don't mess up. I certainly do. I know you do, but you cannot deny the connection between what's in our hearts and how we conduct our lives. Jesus is telling us a profound truth in this parable. He's saying you don't get to just say you're gonna do your chores, you actually have to do them. He's saying you don't get to just say you love God, you actually have to obey his will. And listen, Jesus said the same thing in John 14. Jesus said, if you love me, you will obey my commands. He's saying you don't get to just say you love God. He's saying that you have a relationship with God when you obey the will of God. 2. The challenge of the religious leaders And then, and then Jesus takes this parable and like a shotgun on opening day, he takes it and he turns directly at the religious leaders. So let's look at the challenge that he brings them. So the religious leaders, they answer Jesus and they say, well it was the first son who did the will of the father. And with the shotgun pointed right at them, Jesus pulls the trigger and look what he says in verse 31 and 32. Jesus said to them, truly I say to you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the kingdom of God before you. He goes on to say, for John, speaking of John the Baptist, for John came to you in the way of righteousness, but you did not believe him. But the tax collectors and the prostitutes believed him. And even when you religious people saw it, you did not afterward change your minds and believe him. Okay, there's so much to unpack here. So firstly, if you're unfamiliar with what Jesus is saying here with the tax collectors and the prostitutes. Let me clarify. During Jesus' time, tax collectors and prostitutes were seen as the lowest of the low, the worst sinners. They were seen as immoral and traitors. So here's the context. In Jesus' day, Rome had basically conquered all of the surrounding world. They were the world's superpower at that time. And they had occupied Judea and Jerusalem, where Jesus lived and ministered meaning if you lived where Jesus did when Jesus did you would have seen Roman soldiers all around as they occupied the land they were foreign rulers and what Rome did was they exacted a tax a high tax on people and so what Rome would do is that they would hire local people to collect the taxes. They would hire Jewish people to collect the taxes, meaning fellow Jewish people would start working for their foreign rulers, collecting taxes for Rome, but if that weren't enough, for instance, here's how it would work. For instance, if Rome said the tax was $50, these Jewish tax collectors would charge $60 and then pocket the 10. And Rome just kind of batted an eye at this. So these Jewish tax collectors would be in cahoots with their occupiers and steal from their own people. This of course was seen as an incredible betrayal. It was dirty, it was corrupt, they were seen as traitors. And this is what Jesus is hitting on when he talks about how the tax collectors are getting into heaven ahead of you. This is a group of people who were utterly despised by the religious leaders. And so prostitutes were just that, and I'll try to keep this PG for us here today. Prostitutes were just that. Women who would give up their bodies in exchange for money to anyone willing to pay. This was seen, like it is today, as purveying a perverse culture of debauchery. So for the people of Judea and Jerusalem, tax collectors and prostitutes were seen as lowest of the low. And yet Jesus is saying to these religious people, he's saying that those sinners are actually getting into heaven ahead of them. Listen, I'm not sure you are fully feeling the weight of how much of an affront that must have been to those ears. Like we just hear this all the time because we read our Bibles all the time. This would have been utterly shocking to them and even highly offensive to them. Now, here's what I'm gonna say to you, church. I know so many people who feel like they're just not growing in their faith. And I'll tell you why I think many people stop growing in their faith. It's because they stop feeling the challenge. They no longer are challenged by the faith. They think they know it all. So let me try to bring a correlation here that might help you feel how much of a challenge this might have been. This would have been like if Jesus was speaking to religious people here today, and he would have told you or me in particular as a religious leader, hey, the drug dealers and the drag queens are getting into heaven ahead of you. Like that's the level of like challenge that they felt that we need to feel. To really discern are we doing this because we're just religiously superior or do we have a humble? Repentant faith as we follow God. Then let me just say something because I want to make something Abundantly clear here. This is very popular to bring this up these days Jesus yes, he did hang out with tax collectors and prostitutes. But why? He hung out with tax collectors, Jesus hung out with tax collectors and prostitutes in order to bring them out of their sin and into the kingdom. Look what Jesus says in verse 32. He says, for John, again speaking of John the Baptist, John the Baptist came to you in the way of righteousness and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes, what? Believed. The tax collectors and the prostitutes believed him. I can't underscore this enough because people in our day, we want to say that Jesus hung out with sinners and prostitutes for no other reason other than the fact that he was just a tolerant person and a staple of progressive inclusion. That's not why Jesus hung out with them. He hung out with them because he loved them. Yes, but he loved them enough to proclaim the gospel to them, to let them know there's room in the kingdom for them if they repent and believe in the gospel. It's the religious who need to be challenged on this. And I want to tell you about a time that I had my own, Oh no, I'm a religious person moment. Number of years ago, uh, when I was the family pastor here at peace church, before I became the lead pastor, I went with our children's ministry team to a conference in Atlanta. And our children's team was composed mostly of women, and at that time I went with our Matt Witte, who is currently our facilities director, but back then he was our bold boys leader, our young boys ministry leader. And so we went, we were the only two guys on the strip with a group of ladies. And so we landed in Atlanta, big airports. And in those bigger airports, if you've ever been there, you know that you often have to take like a little train from your terminal to the baggage claim. You know what I'm saying? Okay, so it's Atlanta, so it's big, it's bustling, it's busy and it's packed. And so we, me and the, all these ladies and me and Matt, we get on this little train and we're just scrunched in, it's packed. And this woman came on the train after us. And again, I'll try to keep it PG here. Let's just say it appeared that she was a working girl. And she was clearly medically altered in her appearance and had no problem dressing in a way to show this off. So on this train, she walks in and me and Matt look at her, and then me and Matt look at each other, and then me and Matt look at the ceiling. Oh, look at that. Carpet on fiberglass. Oh, interesting. We're not looking around, right? We're godly men here. But this short little ride, I noticed also on this train in the front, there was this group of these guys. And listen, I'm a pastor and I try to love everybody, but I'll just tell you right now, these guys just didn't, just something about them, okay? Something about them just rubbed me the wrong way. And they were pointing at her and they were clearly talking about her. And so we got to our stop. And of course, you know, when those things stop, everyone wants to get out the exact same time. So we're all getting like shoved out. And it just so happened that she gets shoved up right next to me. And she's got her baggage claim ticket in her hand. And she's trying to show it to me and she says, do you know where this is? And without even looking at her, I said, no, I don't. Sorry. Truth is, I will just tell you now, I wanted to maintain my self-righteousness. I didn't want the women of our children's team thinking that I was hitting on her. I wanted to be above reproach. I didn't want anyone else judging me for talking to her. So we get off the train and there was like five rows of escalators, all right? And I tried to distance myself and I went and got an escalator and we're going up and I look over at one of the escalators down the way and I see her and that group of guys had just surrounded her and the Holy Spirit just spoke to my heart, broke my heart. And I think the message was something like this. Are you really any better than those guys? It was like God was saying to me, that was my lost daughter, and I brought her to you for help, but you were too concerned about your image to help her. It's like God was saying, you're just like those guys. You only saw her as an object. You saw her as an object to be avoided to maintain your self-righteousness. They saw her as an object to be acquired to satisfy their own desires. Was I really any better than them? I looked over and I saw her surrounded by those guys and I will tell you this time I saw her through God's eyes. I saw her as a human, as someone who Christ came to save. But I didn't think that because I was too worried about what people would think of me. You see, here's how you know if you are a religious person. Do you only see people through the choices they've made or do you see people made in the image of God? Now listen, nobody wants to be the religious person but here's what I'll tell you, it's easier to be that person. And here's what I'll tell you, it goes both ways. See, for religious people on the right, we often avoid sinners so that we can feel self-righteous. But I would say religious people on the left, they hang out with sinners so that people will think that they're inclusive. Either way, religious people use others as a means to an end to build up themselves and their own image. But Jesus provides a true and loving way. Listen to me, he didn't hang out with sinners because he was tolerant and progressive, and he didn't avoid them, even when he was criticized by the religious crowd for doing it. I'll tell you now, that story that I just shared with you haunts me, because I wonder, if I had brought her to the baggage claim, if I had brought her to the baggage claim, could I have brought her to the kingdom of God? Now listen, she was not an attractive person. She's what the Bible calls sensual. And maybe there are some guys in here who probably should have avoided a person like that. But it was a crowded space. And I had an opportunity to be a true witness for the gospel with an opportunity that God literally brought right to my doorstep, but I was too concerned about maintaining my pristine religious image. I'll say it again. Guys like Jesus and John the Baptist, they spent time with sinners because they loved them, but they loved them enough to proclaim the gospel to them, to invite them into something better than the life they were living. And look what happened, verse 32, "'But the tax collectors and the prostitutes believed.'" There's the difference, they believe. The tax collectors and the prostitutes, they're getting in front of the line into heaven, not because Jesus thinks they're cool, but because they're sinners who repent and believe the message of the gospel. That's how anyone is getting to heaven. No one is good enough to get into heaven. It is simply and only and wholly and fully the work of Christ. And once we place our faith in Him, that's how we get into heaven. Because when we place our faith in Jesus, the righteousness of Christ is given to us. Not because we earned it, but because God is good and He graciously gives it to us. And the true test as to whether or not a person has repented and believed the gospel, if they're truly sorry for what they've done, is in their changed behavior. Jesus said a tree is known by its fruit, meaning a person is known by the actions, by what happens in their life. Jesus saw the changed behavior of the tax collectors and the prostitutes based on their And Jesus connects them with the Son, the first Son, in the story that we just read. They're the first Son. They first said no to God, but later on they changed their mind and followed Him, unlike the religious people who say yes to God, but they actually don't follow His will. Let me spell this out. Jesus is saying the religious leaders are the second Son. They say they follow God. They say they love God. They say they do God's will but they don't actually do it. You have a religion which is a true relationship with God When you have a when you follow and obey God's will and it's at this point people That you've been listening to Jesus contrast two different parties the first son and the second son, the sinners who repent and the religious people who don't. And it's at this point you have to ask yourself, which one are you? For those who can hear me right now, for those of you in another venue, for those of you listening right now on a podcast in some tree stand. Oh, I'll call anybody out. Don't you worry. Which one are you? Do you follow the right thing to do out of religious duty or out of love for God? Do you sacrifice your preferences to follow God's Will or do you selfishly follow your own wills? Jesus told this parable days before his crucifixion. Before a crucifixion he knew was coming. And when Jesus died on that cross, He died on the cross in our place for our sins. It was our sins that nailed Him there. Jesus took our punishment and we have to ask ourselves, what is our response? To either reject God and go our own way or to repent and change our behavior because we've changed our minds. Listen, I will tell you right now, God is not some distant God. Jesus is not some distant Savior. He is the resurrected and triumphant savior who calls us into relationship With him. This is why the word Reconciliation is such a powerful word for christians because reconciliation means that we've been brought back into relationship with god That's who we are. We are the sons and daughters of the king Remember you have a relationship with god when you obey the will of God. This is such a profound truth and it kind of goes against probably our common notions of what it means to be a Christian. But we have a relationship with God when we stay in His will. Jesus came to pull us back when we stepped outside of His will. But Church, I want you to remember, when we fall short, because we will, and that's not an excuse to fall short. It's just the reality of the world that we live in. When we fall short, remember this, God does not. When our faithfulness waxes and wanes, remember, the faithfulness of God is the greatest there is. Great is His faithfulness towards us. This is why we lean into God. This is why we follow Jesus. Because their love, God's love for us, Christ's love for us, His faithfulness towards us is greater than our own. So, let's prepare our hearts to sing, great is thy faithfulness, because God has yet again shown this church how great His faithfulness is, amen? Amen, would you please stand? Church, I'm gonna ask you to bow your heads, whether you're here or in another venue, would you bow your heads and just reflect for a moment? God has been so good to us. God's been so good to this church. With your heads bowed, I want you just to stand in a moment of gratitude for the way that God's moved in the hearts of this church, the ways He continues to move. And this is because His faithfulness is great, not because we've earned it but because he's good. And so when you sing of God's great faithfulness, do this because you know that he is good. So, Father, we are thankful for the ways that you have moved in this church, but we are even more eternally grateful. The fact that you are God. We are eternally grateful for the gospel that Christ died in our place, for our sins, so that we can be brought back to you, have fellowship with you, and you've sent the Holy Spirit to fill, fuel, and guide your church in this faithfulness. And so, Father, I pray, as we sing these words, Father, I pray that we'd sing them as a church that knows these words are true, that we believe these words are true, because you've shown them time and time again. And we pray these things in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Church, let's worship together.

How to Handle a Difficult Small-Group Member Ministry Rachel Bailey Executive Director Alpha Women’s Center Published On: May 31, 2023 Small group Bible studies are a joy to lead. Any chance to study Scripture in community is a gift. But they can also be challenging to lead, particularly if you have a difficult group member. Perhaps this person has a lot of strong opinions and she’s decided this group is the best place to air them all. Maybe she overshares personal information or always directs the conversation back to herself. She might gossip, revealing inappropriate information about others under the guise of a prayer request. Or perhaps she dominates the conversation, not leaving space for anyone else to speak. Am I making any leaders squirm yet? As I’ve trained leaders to handle these challenging situations , I’ve found three principles helpful. 1. Set Firm Boundaries Establishing standards and expectations from the beginning is loving. This gives something tangible to refer back to when boundaries are tested. And it creates an opportunity to clearly address problems like gossip, talking over one another, or disregarding Scripture. Although boundaries are ideally established from the start, if you’re leading an existing small group , it’s never too late. Look for a natural place to introduce boundaries, like after a summer break, at the start of a new year, or when changing your topic of study . One way to set boundaries is to create a written group agreement and have everyone sign it. Another option is to write it out in an email and ask all participants to reply to indicate they’ve read it. Or you might just have the conversation verbally. Consider the dynamics of your group and what would be most loving and effective in your situation. 2. Extend Grace When you have a difficult member in your group, it can be easy to focus on the challenges he or she creates for you as the leader. Take a deep breath and ask God to help you see the bigger picture. Let’s think through a few reasons someone may be a difficult group member: She’s lonely, lacking other community, and expressing her desire for connection in unhealthy ways. She’s an immature Christian (or not a Christian at all), lacking the fruit of the Spirit. She’s struggling with a mental or emotional disorder which may inhibit her ability to function appropriately in the group. She’s been hurt by a community in the past. What do all these situations have in common? They describe people who need the grace and kindness of God as much as you do. If you discover your difficult group member has one of these deeper concerns, let it inform how you approach her. Exercise wisdom based on her particular circumstances, and seek to extend the same compassion and grace you’ve received from the Lord. 3. Have a Conversation Extending grace doesn’t mean allowing inappropriate behavior to continue unchecked. When a boundary has been repeatedly crossed, it’s time to speak with the person and address the issue clearly . Confronting others makes my palms sweat. Perhaps it makes you uncomfortable too. But lovingly correcting a brother or sister is a biblical call we must take seriously, particularly as leaders ( 2 Tim. 4:2 ; 2 Thess. 3:15 ). Here’s how you might approach the conversation depending on the issue you need to address. Conversation Dominators If someone constantly dominates the conversation, you have the freedom and responsibility as the leader to redirect the discussion during group time: “Hey ____, thanks for your thoughts. Let’s take a moment to hear from ____ about this topic.” In a private conversation with the group member, specifically describe her negative behavior. Encourage her to hone her gifts by looking out for those who are shy or not engaging and to use her voice to cheer on others whose voices aren’t being heard. Toxic Sharers Your group needs to be a refuge for sharing struggles, not a place for gossip to fester. Toxic Sharers may divulge too much information about themselves or others in the group, or they might share other members’ prayer requests with people outside the group. All of this must be snuffed out immediately. Don’t shy away from quickly redirecting the conversation during a group meeting, even if it feels awkward. As with the Conversation Dominator, you should have a private conversation with the Toxic Sharer where you describe her negative behavior. Acknowledge her need to feel seen and heard, and give her examples of appropriate ways to handle sensitive information in the future. One Who Needs to Leave What if you’ve had multiple conversations with a difficult group member and brought another believer with you to confront her, yet she’s still unwilling to change? At this point, we’re talking about blatant disregard for the boundaries and well-being of the group. Set up a time to meet with the person in a public space, potentially with a mediator, and include the following in your conversation: A specific description of the unrepentant sinful behavior A clear request for the person to leave the group, effective immediately A sincere commitment to pray for her It’s important to remember that we as imperfect humans will never adhere to standards and expectations perfectly, whether as group members or as leaders. But by God’s grace, we can seek to maintain a healthy, God-honoring atmosphere in our small groups. When you encounter a difficult member in your group, I encourage you to pray through your approach, seek the wisdom of your pastor or ministry leader, and avoid the pitfalls of inaction or anger. May our good and merciful God be glorified in how we handle the difficult group members in our care. More Blogs You'll Like What Is a Deacon? Exploring the Role, Qualifications, and Purpose of Deacons in the Church Read More What Is An Elder? A biblical definition of those who are called to lead Read More Why Church Membership Understanding the Biblical Foundations of Church Membership Read More

Christianity and Politics: Where Do We Go From Here? Session 4 Video Teaching Jon Delger Jon Delger I Didn't Know I Needed the Church Jon Delger Coming Out of Catholicism | Session 2 Creating Meaningful Traditions Jon Delger Christianity and Politics: Q+A Jon Delger I Didn't Know I Needed the Bible Jon Delger Coming Out of Catholicism | Session 1 Jon Delger Withstand: How The Culture War Is A Spiritual Battle Jon Delger Christianity and Politics: Where Do We Go From Here? Jon Delger Coming Out of Catholicism | Q & A Kelly Needham | Women's Christmas Party People Pleasing Jon Delger Christianity and Politics: Are We a Christian Nation?

Joseph's Suffering Taste & See Women's Conference | Session 1 Video Teaching Ally Mollenkamp Jon Delger I Didn't Know I Needed the Church Jon Delger Coming Out of Catholicism | Session 2 Creating Meaningful Traditions Jon Delger Christianity and Politics: Q+A Jon Delger I Didn't Know I Needed the Bible Jon Delger Coming Out of Catholicism | Session 1 Jon Delger Withstand: How The Culture War Is A Spiritual Battle Jon Delger Christianity and Politics: Where Do We Go From Here? Jon Delger Coming Out of Catholicism | Q & A Kelly Needham | Women's Christmas Party People Pleasing Jon Delger Christianity and Politics: Are We a Christian Nation?

Logan Bailey Logan Bailey is the Discipleship Pastor at Peace Church. He and his wife Rachel have a son. Most Recent Content from Logan Bailey The Lord Is Mine Watch Sermon A Psalm of Solomon Watch Sermon New Year New Life Good morning. How are we doing? I've said it before, I'll say it again, the front row is where the fire is at, but there are four front... Watch Sermon Avoiding the Burnout Trap READ MORE Psalm 23 for the Idolatry-Prone Minister When I was young and excited about starting in ministry, my youth pastor gave me a warning: “too many pastors let ministry become their... READ MORE Offering Teenagers Hope for Their Habits Do you watch TV? Like, a lot of TV? I know I am not the only one who frequently finds myself coming home, sitting on the couch, and... READ MORE How to Plan the Next Youth Retreat with Confidence It came quick. This year’s Fall retreat is just around the corner. Questions fill your mind: Did you forget to sign a contract with the... READ MORE

On The Cross (Part 1) Sermon Series: It Had To Be Said Ryan DB Kimmel Lead Pastor Peace Church Main Passage: Luke 23:34 Transcript Today is the day that the Lord has made. So let us rejoice and be glad in it and everyone everywhere, including the venue and the chapel and those online that we all said together, amen. Amen. So church, we do live in a world where there is no shortage of words. English, they say is the most wordy language of all time. And thanks to this thing, for those listening on a podcast later, this is a phone, our phone. Thanks to this thing, we have way too much access to far too much of what's being said in our world. Our world has no shortage of words or opinions. We live in a world where feelings are seen as just as valid as facts. In this world, we have to ask ourselves, when we have access to so much, where can we turn to for words that will cut through the noise? Where can we turn to to find words that are comforting, challenging, and true? Where can we turn to find words that are both timely and timeless? Words that were as much needed as when they were spoken as they are needed now? I'll tell you, there's one place, and that's the scriptures. And we've been doing that this summer as we look at words that cut through the noise, words of Jesus Christ. Again this series has been looking at words simply from Jesus, what's often called the red letter words. Words not just from anyone, but words from Jesus Christ. Words, quotes, that changed the world. And I'll just tell you right now, the words of Jesus that we're going to look at today, they most certainly change the world, but I will tell you right now, they are words that specifically changed me. Coming back from sabbatical, I wanted to preach a message that was deeply personal to me to share some things. As we look at, I think, the words that the Holy Spirit used to cut through my heart, to call me to faith in Jesus. And so if you have your Bibles, would you please turn to the Gospel of Luke, chapter 23. We'll be looking at verse 34 today. If you want to use the Bibles we've provided, happy for you to do that, that's on page 1124. Again, these are words that Jesus Christ spoke from the cross, and they're words that the Holy Spirit used, as much as I can say this, to cut into my heart and call me to faith in Jesus Christ. They are words that Jesus said after his torture, during his crucifixion. Now, if you know anything about the physiology of a crucifixion, to even speak during crucifixion was extremely painful. And Jesus finds the strength to say the words that we're going to look at today. Jesus said these words as he was looking upon the people, the very people that were doing this to Him. And this is what He said. And so, would you hear the word of the Lord, the words of Jesus? Luke, chapter 23, verse 34. Luke 23:34 And Jesus said, Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do. This is God's holy word. Let's pray and we'll continue. Let's pray. Father, we come to you in prayer. We come to you in the name of Jesus, by the power of the Holy Spirit, asking that you would be with us today, helping us to know the truth of your word, timeless and timely words that we might know salvation in Jesus' name, that we might, by the blood of Jesus, be brought back into a relationship with you, our good and glorious God and we do pray these things for your glory for our joy and for the good of our neighbor we do pray these things and everyone said all together amen. So father forgive them for they do not know what they do Jesus Christ prayed this for the people who were killing him as they were killing him while he hung on the cross. When I first read these words as an 18-year-old, and I understood what was happening in this moment when Jesus said this, it was like I was on the road of life. And when I read these words, it was like God brought this enormous roadblock and set it right in front of me, and said, this is your path no longer. I have a new path for you to follow the way of my son. Has it been perfect since then? Nope, it's been pretty bumpy and rocky at times. But since that time, confessing my faith in Jesus, I've walked the path of the way, the way of Christ. When I read these words as a high school kid, I will tell you, I lost. My defenses failed me. I couldn't get around these words. Every argument that I had against the Christian faith suddenly became very brittle and hollow. And it was like God said to me, you're mine now, and I have a better plan for you. Now listen, Jesus Christ, as you've heard all summer long, he said some powerful words, he said comforting words, he said challenging words, at times Jesus even said some condemning words, but you know what these are for me? You know what sort of words these are? These are confirming words for me. These words, when you understand what's happening and you understand the moment that Jesus was in when he said this, they are like confirming words. They reveal who he is and what he's come to do. And it shows us why Jesus is so amazing. So as we begin to look at the end of the summer, rather than three points today, I'll keep it easy on you, we'll just do two points today as we look at this wonderful, powerful verse. Two things today. On the cross we see firstly that Jesus prays for sinners, and secondly on the cross we see that Jesus provides for salvation. All right, so let's get into it. First point. Jesus prays for sinners. Keep your Bibles open here today. Verse 34. In these words, Father forgive them for they do not know what they do, we see Jesus doing something remarkable. I've said it before, I'll say it again because you cannot forget this. Jesus was praying this for the people who were killing him as they were killing him. Say what you want about Jesus Christ, but you cannot deny that this man lived everything he taught. Jesus prays for sinners. This is a prayer. So let's talk about prayer for a second. Bump your neighbor and say we're talking about prayer because we're talking about prayer right now. Now I've always said there's two types of Christians. There's those who pray and those who say they pray. And I looked at my life and for a long time I thought to myself. I don't pray enough to really qualify myself as a praying man. There was this one time a number of years back that I was I was leading a mission trip to a place called Switzer West Virginia. Now you people who are West Michiganders, you have no idea where Switzer West Virginia is and there's no reason for you to know where that is. It's in the middle of nowhere Appalachia. Like when you go to the middle of Appalachia and you're lost, keep going and maybe you'll find Switzer. This is where we were at as a group. Now I brought a group down there to help out this little church. Then what happened during the week was there's these three little old ladies who would come to the church every single day and they would make us lunch. And one day we got our morning project done early. So I thought, you know, I'm gonna go help these little ladies get ready for lunch. So I go into their little church and I'm walking down the stairs and I get to their basement and I start walking towards the little kitchenette that they have and one of the women was on the phone and she says, Oh my goodness, yes, we'll pray for that. And then she hung up the phone. Now I know some of you don't know what I mean when I say hung up the phone. See, you know, back in the olden days, in the 1900s, there was this thing, phones were actually attached to a wall and were connected by a cord. And you knew the people who were extremely talkative, because their cord was a lot longer than other people's cord. If you remember, some cords were like 35 feet long, and that's so mom or grandma could talk throughout the entire house and still be connected to the wall. Let me see, who here had a mom or a grandma like that? Who here was a mom or grandma like that? Yeah, okay. So I get down and I'm walking to this kitchenette and she says, Oh my goodness, yes, I'll pray for that. She hangs up the phone. She turns to her friends and she says, so-and-so is going in for emergency emergency surgery right now. And I'm walking up to these three little old ladies and they say, would you like to pray with us? And do you know what went through my head? That Eminem song. This looks like a job for me. Like I was like, I'm here. This is why I'm here. I'm the highest ranking person here. So yes, I will pray. And in my mind, I thought for just a second, I was outlining how the prayer was gonna go. You know how this works around here. We got this really unique way of doing prayer where someone says, okay, why don't you start, and if anyone feels like they are led to pray, go ahead and pray, and then I'll close it up at the end. You know how we do that around here, right? Yeah, okay, so apparently not everyone does it like that. So I'm walking up and they say, would you like to pray with us? And I say yes, thinking this is how it's gonna go. But no sooner did I say yes, than did these three women all start praying at the same time out loud. And I realized in a fraction of a second, I am seriously outgunned here. I've just entered something new. I don't pray like that. The pastors I know, we don't pray like that. I am telling you, it was a deep prayer. It was devoted. It was desperate. It was a prayer pouring out their hearts. It was a prayer that they fully believed that God could heal. It was unashamed because they were all talking at the same time and they didn't care what anyone thought of their prayers. They were crying out to their God. It was a beautiful thing. You know, what makes someone brave is not just what they're willing to do, but what they're willing to do in front of other people. And so let me just throw a challenge out to the Christian men in the house. Pray out loud. Pray out loud with your wife, with your family, with your kids. Jesus Christ was on the cross. You want to talk about an inconvenient time to pray? He is on the cross and he still prays. So when I was in that little prayer circle with these women, I'll be honest with you, I walked away from that prayer time really discouraged. And I was really discouraged for a long time. It troubled me. Because you want to know what I did? I made that the gold standard for prayer. For a long time I was discouraged about my prayer life because I didn't pray like that. Nobody I knew really prayed like that. And I was really discouraged for a long time. Until my understanding of prayer, look to the scripture. When you get to the scriptures, you see something drastically different. See, when I was growing up, I thought prayer was that time that you carved out at some point in the day, and you folded your hands, and you got on your knees, and you closed your eyes, and then you started praying like you were writing a letter. Dear God, how are you today? That's how I thought prayer was. I thought it was simple and like writing a letter and then I experienced these ladies and then I was like, oh wait, wait, no, it must be really big and broad. But then when I started searching more and more of the scriptures, you see something, all that and more. See, when you look at the prayers of the scriptures, you see raw, honest prayers. You see honest prayers. And what I mean is that sometimes people who are praying in the Bible, they're confused about what God is doing or what God is allowing. When you look at some prayers in the scriptures, there's not many of them that are very elaborate or even deeply religious sounding. And yet Christ shows us something beautiful that you can pray even through excruciating pain. Prayer is not a letter to God. Prayer is talking to the Father through the Son in the power of the Spirit and then listening. See, I once thought prayer was patient and on your knees, and I thought it was powerful and out loud. Then I realized it's all that and more. Those ladies will always be champions of the faith in my book, but I'll tell you now, they're no longer the gold standard of prayer for me. You want to know what is? It's this prayer of Jesus that we're looking at today. This is a prayer, mind you. Father, forgive them. This prayer from Jesus on the cross, this is the epitome of grit. It's selfless, it's short, it's faithful. For many of us, we don't pray, we just say we do. And I'm telling you, we are missing out on so much. This is the prayer of our Savior as He was dying. This is what he's praying as he's dying, as they are killing him. It's this prayer, Jesus pleading with God the Father for the forgiveness of the people who are killing him. He's praying this as they are killing him. What sort of man is this? Can you imagine a woman praying for the forgiveness of her husband as he is cheating on her? Can you imagine a 68 year old man praying for the forgiveness of his accountant as his accountant is draining his retirement dry? What sort of man is this? There is something else going on here with Jesus. Jesus is praying for the forgiveness of the people who are killing him as they're killing him. But listen here, it does not end there. It gets even more powerful. See, Jesus Christ, yes, He does die on that cross. He is killed on that cross. He does not come off alive. They take His dead body off the cross and they lay it in a tomb where it lays stone-cold dead for three days. But then, in this little thing we call the resurrection, the Son of God rose again. The resurrection is what makes or breaks the Christian faith. Jesus Christ rose again. And then for 40 days, he continued to minister, and then he returned to heaven. So here's the question, what's Jesus doing now in heaven? Well, aside from ruling and reigning, did you know that Jesus is also praying for you? He prays for us still. Romans chapter 8, verse 34. Jesus Christ, who died more than that, who was raised to life, is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us. This is take a moment, listen to the rain, embrace it, it's beautiful. Notice here it says, he's at the right hand of God, interceding for us. It doesn't say praying, it uses a special word, interceding, intercession. Now listen, if you're like me and you come from a pretty conservative background, that's probably not a word you hear a lot, but it's a biblical scriptural word that is a way to pray. Now what is intercession? Intercession is praying where we stand in the gap for someone else and we intervene in on their behalf in prayer. And so, when Jesus says, Father forgive them, for they know not what they do, I would tell you that is the greatest in a sensory prayer in all of the Bible. Ten words in English, it was actually only eight words in Greek, and it is a prayer that still changes hearts. Jesus still intercedes for us. Hebrews chapter 7 verse 25 says, Therefore Jesus is able to save completely those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them. Christians, listen to me. Jesus is praying for you right now. Right now in heaven, Jesus is speaking your name to God the Father, and he's praying for you. But this here, right now, this is the point where you ask me, so what? Because here's one of the things I really want us to do as a church, I want us to be able to ask really big, hard questions. We need to be able to express our doubts and have our questions and ask them. And you can ask any question you want here without judgment. We want to have conversations. We want you to bring your questions. In fact, I want you to think about your hardest possible question and then send it to Pastor John. That's what I want you to do. So Jesus is praying for us. Okay, I invite you to ask the question, so what? My friend, here's the so what. Knowing that Jesus is praying for you, I want you to remember this because whatever life throws at you, whatever people do to you, whatever your boss is like, whatever your marriage is like, however hurtful your friends can be, I want you to remember at all times that the Savior of the world is praying for you by name in heaven right now. And let that wash over you and remind you how deeply cared for and loved you are by God. Now, before we get to our second point, I just want to call out something that many of you probably have noticed if you have your Bibles open. If you have your Bibles open, you'll notice that we're not actually looking at one verse today. We're looking at half of a verse today. Verse 34 continues. It goes on to say this, and Jesus said, Father, forgive them for they know not what they do and they cast lots to divide his garments. So not only were they killing him, but as they were killing him, they were gambling to see who gets his stuff. They were slaughtering him and stealing from him at the same time. And listen to me, not just his stuff, his garments, that means his clothes. For us in the modern age, it's very hard for us to understand how absolutely horrible crucifixion was. It was designed to bring about the most intense, horrendous possible physical pain, while also making you go through the most horrendous psychological torture imaginable. Because one thing you need to know about Romans is when they crucified people, they stripped them naked first, and they crucified them naked. Jesus Christ was naked on the cross, praying for the forgiveness of people who were killing him as they were killing him, as they were stealing his clothes right in front of him. Bring me any other religious leader, because they've got nothing on Jesus. My friend, do not delay. Cast your sin aside, cast your pride aside, and lay it all before the cross, because there is no one like Him. There is no one who has done for you apart from what Christ has done for you. There is no one who will call you like Jesus will, who loves you like He does. What He did for those men is a shadow of what He's done for the entire world, what He's done for you. So do not delay. The cast lots to divide his garments and yet he still prays for them. This is how amazing of a Savior we have in Jesus Christ. Jesus prays for sinners, for you and for me, and he also provides for salvation. And Jesus said, Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they do. They do not know what they're doing. Okay, so what were they doing? If they don't know, what were they actually doing? Let's talk about that. See, here's what so many people get wrong about the death of Jesus. So many people, especially in our culture, so many people have this understanding that Jesus was simply this nice guy who was wrongfully murdered and it's so sad what happened to this nice guy by these evil people. Now think about it from their perspective for a second. Think about it from the authority's perspective for a moment, because it's not just what Jesus did that got him killed, it's what he said that got him killed. Let's look at some of these things. Mark 11, verse 26, Jesus said that unless you forgive, you will not be forgiven. Jesus said in John 10 30, Jesus said that he and God the Father were one. They were the same. They were one in essence. Matthew chapter 5 verse 40, Jesus said that someone asks for your coat, you are to give them your shirt as well. Wasn't Jesus living that one out here? John chapter 14 verse 6, Jesus said that He was the only way to heaven, that He was the only way to God the Father. My friends, you don't get to say the things that Jesus said unless you are who Jesus said He was. Church, I will tell you now, it was realizing this that God turned my heart and made me become a Christian. If Jesus isn't Emmanuel, if Jesus isn't God with us, if Jesus isn't the Savior of the world, if the things that Jesus said were not true, then listen to me, then he got what he deserved. You don't get to say the things that Jesus said if they're not true. You don't get to say the things that Jesus said if you weren't who Jesus said he was. If Jesus wasn't who he said he was, then do not call him a great moral teacher. Rather, he was the greatest liar the world has ever known, and he should not be venerated. He should be demonized or at least forgotten. If Jesus wasn't who he said he was, if Jesus was lying, he got what he deserved. But what's beautiful about this is that Jesus took everything he said and he went all the way with it, all the way even to his death. Father, forgive them for they do not know what they do. Jesus knew in this moment that his death on the cross was a pivotal moment in all of human history, but he knew that they didn't realize it. See, they thought they were killing a rebel against Rome. They thought they were killing another common criminal. They didn't realize that they were killing the one who is providing them salvation. What were they doing? They were killing the Savior of the world. But what was Jesus doing? He was the perfect Son of God, and in this moment He is dying for the sins of the world. He is paying the penalty that your sins and my sins deserve. He was taking the punishment that was for us to bear. The world that is around us does not realize this. Some of you sitting here right now, you do not realize what happened when Jesus Christ died on the cross. It was five long years that my wife and I were in the adoption process. But when the time finally came for us to fly to Ethiopia and to adopt our son, we sat nervously in that Ethiopian courthouse and we waited our turn to meet the judge. Now listen, this was one of the greatest moments of our lives. And it was also one of the greatest moments of our son's life, but he had no idea what was happening. But I don't think that negates how monumental of a moment it was for him. Our son did nothing to contribute to the adoption process aside from being born. Yet the adoption, becoming finalized, was one of the biggest moments of his life, and he doesn't remember it. It's like this, Christ dying on the cross is one of the biggest moments of your life, and some of you don't realize it yet. But realizing this and accepting this truth will change everything. It changes hearts. Father forgive them, for they do not know what they do. What were they doing? They were killing the Savior of the world. They were fulfilling prophecy. They were witnessing firsthand the righteous judgment of God being poured out on His Son for the sins of the world. Jesus in this moment is providing salvation for all who will place their faith in Him. Because this is what happened. This is what happened on the cross. Jesus took your sin and took the punishment you deserve so you don't have to. They don't know what they do. Jesus is reminding us how lost the world is. The world doesn't know. The world, back then, those soldiers had Jesus right in front of them. They had the crucifixion live happening right before them, and they didn't realize what was happening. Many people can look upon Jesus, many people can come to church many people can hear the gospel proclaimed and not realize their need for a Savior and It's because we are lost. It's because our hearts are hardened The world is lost and they don't realize who Christ is or what he's done. The world is lost and they don't know what they do This is why Christians should be the most empathetic and compassionate people on the planets. Listen, if someone is lost in the woods and they're trying to find their way home and they're going in the wrong direction, do you hate them for it? No, of course not. Likewise, in this world, when people promote sin, we should not hate them for it. On the flip, we should be empathetic because they are lost, they're going in the wrong direction. Or even more, like Jesus, we should be pleading with God for their forgiveness because they don't know what they are doing. When I see people choose the desires of sin rather than the joy of Jesus, it's not pity I feel, it's not hatred I feel, it's empathy, it's compassion. In some ways it's sadness because I wish they knew that what Christ offers is infinitely better. When I first read this verse as an 18 year old, you want to know what I thought? I was thinking to myself, if I was in Jesus' shoes, if I was on the cross, after a lifetime of pouring out love to these people, and this is what they were doing to me, if I was in that moment, you want to know what? This is where I'd show my cards. This is where I'd show my cards. I'd be sitting there from the cross. I'd take every ounce and I'd say I can't believe you people everything I've done for you I Served you I taught you I've done all these wonderful things for you. And this is what you do for me That's what you do to me. You all can go to hell That's what I would say because I would show my cards as the sinful wretch that I am but you want to know something Jesus does show His cards here. He's showing the world exactly who He is. Jesus shows His cards and it's amazing. When I first read this verse at that moment, I realized what I was doing. I was spiritually blind, living a life of sin, putting myself before God, putting myself before others, wanting to be accepted by the world rather than wanting to be accepted by the creator of the world. This verse spoke deep into my heart. I don't know if you've noticed this, my friends, but it seems like, especially in the last generation, that people in our world have graduated from celebrating sin to finding identity in it. But they do this because they don't know what they do. They're lost. They give themselves to sin. And what we need to know, what we need to be reminded of is that sin is what put Jesus on the cross, my sin and your sin. And it was in reading this that my spirit was broken. It was in reading this that I realized that Jesus was the one worth giving my life to, that He was who He said He was. And so when we repent of our sin on Christ and Christ pays the penalty for us. And because our sin has been punished and not just ignored, this is why we can rightly say and rightly sing as we did in the beginning that justice has been satisfied and all Christians should say amen at this. And not only this, but our sin is taken away as if that wasn't enough, we are given abundant life, and if that wasn't enough, we're given eternal life, and if that wasn't enough, you know what also we get? We get brought back into the family of God. We get reconciled to God and we get to have a relationship with our Creator again, and this is because of what Jesus has done for us. And so, church, when you read these words, many of your Bibles will have these words in red, and it's very appropriate because these truly are blood-stained words, as we see how these words cut through all the noise. Church today we read a quote from Christ that changed the world. My prayer is that it will change you, and that the Spirit will call you into a faith in Jesus. But for those of us who have faith, let me remind you, Jesus prays for us, He provides salvation. And for those of you who are walking with the Lord, is there any, let me ask you, is there any better response to this any, let me ask you, is there any better response to this than to worship? If you agree with that, say Amen. Amen. Would you please stand?

Take Up Your Cross Sermon Series: It Had To Be Said Jon Delger Multiplication Pastor Peace Church Main Passage: Mark 8:31-38 Transcript All right, church, if you grab your Bible, would you open with me to Mark chapter 8. Mark chapter 8, we're going to be looking at verses 31 through 38 this morning. If you don't have a Bible, feel free to look for one around you. There's one on a table or on a shelf in any of the worship venues. You can grab one of those and turn to page 1073. We're continuing our series called It Had to be Said. Quotes from Christ that changed the world. And this morning, we're going to look at, I think, what is probably one of the most famous and one of the most challenging quotes of Jesus in all of the Bible. I know it's Fourth of July week, it's sunshine. You wouldn't think that this is the time to hear a hard, challenging word from Jesus. But you know what? As I thought about that this week, I just thought, you know what? That's exactly when we need to hear it is when things are going well, when the sun is shining, the Lord gets us ready for when things are not always that way. So would you hear with me Mark chapter 8, we're going to start reading in verse 31. I'll read it, then we'll pray, then we'll get to work. Here we go. Mark 8, starting in verse 31. Mark 8:31-38 31 And he began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes and be killed, and after three days rise again. 32 And he said this plainly. And Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. 33 But turning and seeing his disciples, he rebuked Peter and said, “Get behind me, Satan! For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man.” 34 And calling the crowd to him with his disciples, he said to them, “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me. 35 For whoever would save his life[a] will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake and the gospel's will save it. 36 For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world and forfeit his soul? 37 For what can a man give in return for his soul? 38 For whoever is ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of him will the Son of Man also be ashamed when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.” This is God's word, amen. Let's pray. Father in heaven, we thank you for your word, this absolute truth before us, this word from you to your people. God, I pray that you would open up our hearts so we would hear it. God, I pray that you would fill me with your Holy Spirit, a broken instrument to bring your perfect word to your people. God, I pray that you'd be glorified and that our hearts would be changed and transformed. Pray this all in Jesus' powerful name, amen. It's amazing how something can seem upside down until you look at it from the right perspective, isn't it? I just had that experience just yesterday. One of my boys was on the couch And he was standing on his head, and he said daddy you're upside down, and I said no son you're upside down Just for fun. I thought maybe we could all experience that together take a look and tell your neighbor What you think you see on the screen here? Is it a squirrel or is it a horse? Try again tell your neighbor what you think you see. Is it a horse? Or is it a man? One more, one more. What do you think you see? I love the crowd participation up here. It's awesome. Is it a lion or is it a mouse? That last one always gets me. In the passage that we're going to look at this morning, our passage starts with Jesus explaining what it means to be the Messiah. Namely, that it means to be killed. At the end of our passage, Jesus goes on to explain what it means to be one of his disciples, namely that it also means to be rejected and to suffer. And in the middle of the passage, we have a scene that connects the two together. We've got Peter, you gotta love Peter. Peter takes the thing that everybody's thinking and he says it out loud. Peter grabs Jesus and he pulls him aside and he says, Jesus, there's no way. You can't die. And Jesus says those same words, get behind me, Satan. And He goes on to explain, and this is I think the key phrase for understanding the whole passage. He says to Peter, for you have your minds set on the things of man instead of on the things of God. You see, what Jesus lays out is two ways. My way and Jesus's way. And he shows us that from the perspective of man, Jesus's way looks upside down. From Peter's perspective, from the disciples perspective, from you and I perspective, the way of the cross looks upside down. But the problem is not with Jesus. The problem is actually that we have the mindset, the perspective of human beings, instead of the mindset and the perspective of God. I think Proverbs 14, 12 sums it up really well. It says, there's a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death. Like Peter, all of us from time to time in our lives, we try to pull Jesus aside. We say, hey, Jesus, come over here. Let me tell you, your way is a little upside down. See, I've actually got another way and my way is the right way. I think I got this whole thing figured out. Jesus, let me just explain to you my way and how things should go. Our way makes sense. It looks right to us. Jesus's way looks wrong from our perspective. But Jesus says that's because we have our minds set in the things of man instead of the things of God. That actually our way leads to death, whereas Jesus' way leads to life. So in our passage this morning, the main idea that we're going to see is this, that Jesus' disciples follow the way of the cross and not the way of the world. Jesus' disciples follow the way of the cross and not the way of the world. And we're going to walk through the passage, we're going to see three comparisons in the main quote, the primary quote comes in verses 34 and following, and so we're going to see as we walk through that three different comparisons that Jesus makes as he tries to make his points about the upside-down way of the cross that we are called to. 2. Save it vs. lose it (vv. 34-35) So let's do that. Let's jump in. Let's take a look at the first one here. Save it or lose it. Take a look with me at verses 34 and 35. And calling the crowd to him with his disciples he said to them, if anyone would come after me let him deny himself, take up his cross, and follow me. For whoever would save his life will lose it. But whoever loses his life for my sake and for the gospels will save it. So you have to imagine sort of how the Jews at the time would have seen the Messiah. They would have thought of a Messiah who was going to come and who was going to have only victory, right? A guy who was going to come and be a conquering hero, right? Remember the Jews are under the thumb of Rome. You think of Palm Sunday, you think of them waving palm branches and then celebrating and welcoming Jesus as King, thinking that he was going to overthrow Rome and have this massive victory. You think of even after Jesus' death on the cross and his resurrection, you think of what the disciples say in Acts chapter 1. The disciples say to Jesus, right, Jesus is just about to go to heaven, and they still say to him, they still say to him, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel? Right, they still in their minds even then thought of Jesus as this military political Messiah who only conquers, who only has victories. They can't even imagine the idea of him having defeat. Now you and I are used to hearing about the cross, right? We've heard the story of the cross for so long. It's actually shaped the world ever since it happened. But if you try to get that out of your minds and just think about at the time of Jesus how crazy it would sound that the Son of God would come down to the earth, that he'd be born in a manger, that he'd live as a carpenter's son, that he would suffer, that he'd be hated, that he would die, he'd be tortured, he'd bleed out on a cross. That's crazy. That seems upside down and backwards, I think, from a human perspective. We would think that he should march in and conquer Only victory and in fact that's exactly the temptation actually that Jesus faces a few times throughout his life. I think of when Jesus is out in the wilderness for 40 days at the beginning of his ministry Satan comes to him. Here's Matthew chapter 4 Satan offers this temptation to Jesus says again The devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. He said to him, all these I will give you if you will fall down and worship me. Jesus said to him, be gone Satan for it's written you shall worship the Lord your God alone and him only will you serve. Satan offers Jesus you don't have to go to the cross, you don't have to suffer, you don't have to be rejected, if you just bow down to me you can have the throne. You can have the whole world. You can have the crown without the cross. And Jesus knows that this is a temptation. He rejects it. But you see when Peter comes, Jesus sees the exact same scheme in front of him, right? Peter pulls him aside and he says, Jesus, come here. You don't have to go to the cross. We're not going to let you die. I'll lead a revolt before I let you die on a cross. And Jesus sees this is not the word of my father. This is not the word of a friend. This is the voice of Satan. Get behind me, Satan. Jesus himself knows that he did not come to go straight to victory, he came in fact to suffer even though it sounds crazy to us. Another passage that points out just how crazy I think this sounds to us, 1st Corinthians chapter 1, says for Jews the man signs and Greeks seek wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly, foolishness to Gentiles. But to both, the power of God and the wisdom of God. The way of the cross seems upside down and backwards, but it's exactly why Jesus came. I think of Mark 10, 45, where Jesus says, I came not to be served, but to serve and to give my life as a ransom for many. I think of Hebrews 9, 22, that says, there is no remission of sins without the shedding of blood. The good news of the gospel is that Jesus didn't simply come to go straight to victory. Jesus came first to suffer and to pay for our sins. He came to bleed and to cleanse you and I. He came to go to the cross and to take the wrath of his father for our sin. His suffering, his wounds are what lead to our healing, our forgiveness, our salvation. That's the good news of the gospel. That's why Jesus came. After Jesus teaches them why he came and what it means to be the Messiah, the seemingly upside down way of the cross, he goes on to explain to his disciples the seemingly upside-down way of being a follower of Jesus. Just as Jesus couldn't have the crown without the cross in the same ways Christians, we can't have the crown without the cross. Makes me think of a passage, Revelation 2, verse 10, Jesus is speaking to the church in one of his letters. He says, do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison that you might be tested and for ten days you will have tribulation. Be faithful unto death and I will give you the crown of life." Be faithful unto death and I will give you the crown of life. Jesus tells his disciples something that is just as crazy as the Son of God dying on a cross. That to follow the Son of God means that you will suffer. That if you want to live, you got to die. That if you want to have eternal joy, you've got to suffer. The cross is not an ornament, it's not a piece of jewelry, it's a symbol of torture and death. That's the symbol that you and I carry around on us, the cross. John 15, Jesus says, "'A servant is not above his master. "'If they persecuted me, they will persecute you.'" Now, some people in the room this morning might be surprised to hear this. Hopefully, if you've been coming to Peace Church for a while, hopefully you're not surprised, but I think some might be surprised to hear this because there are other preachers in the world who preach a gospel that is not this gospel. They want to explain that actually to follow Jesus means that you will always have everything that you want. That if you follow Jesus you'll always be healthy, you'll always be happy, you'll always have all the financial resources you need. But unfortunately that's not what the Bible says. That's not what this passage says. And so just in case you're not fully convinced of that yet, I want to, I want to actually give you a bunch of passages to help you grasp that. I just want that to sink in. I want you to walk out of here fully convinced that Jesus Christ didn't come to give us a life on this earth of luxury, but he actually came to call us to a life of suffering. Here's Romans chapter eight, this is verse 16 and 17. It says, the spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. If children, then heirs, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ that all sounds wonderful doesn't it maybe you've heard that part of the passage before here's the here's how that verse finishes provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him Jesus says there's no victory without suffering. No cross, no crown. You can't have the baby without going through the labor. Just a few weeks ago I got to be in Indianapolis at that conference that we talked about a minute ago. And as we were going around at that conference at the same time in Indianapolis, were also the Olympic swim trials going on. And so as we go to the restaurants and as we go it was actually right across the street And so we come across some of the swimmers and I could identify the swimmers every time they were tall. They had long arms long legs and they had massive shoulders Walk into a restaurant, but there's a swimmer. There's a swimmer. There's a swimmer. You said these massive shoulders man. I mean, they're just huge I'll tell you what those men and women did not get off the couch one day and say I'm going to go swim in the Olympic trials They would tell you no pain no gain these people suffered They worked out they worked hard in order to be at the Olympic trials. Jesus calls us To pain in order to get to glory a couple more passages Ephesians chapter 1 13 and 14 it says in him you also when you heard the word of truth the gospel of your salvation and believed in him were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit Who is the guarantee of our inheritance? Until we acquire possession of it You hear what he's saying? What he's saying is that you have an inheritance You have heaven you have you have the Lord you have an eternal life and joy awaiting you But it's not yet It's coming But it's not here yet. In this life we do get tastes of that inheritance. We do get tastes of that eternal joy, but it's mostly spiritual, right? We get forgiveness of sins, we get a relationship with the Lord, we get some earthly pleasures, but ultimately it's ahead of us. Ultimately it's out there in front of us still. Romans 8 24 and 25, in this hope we were saved. Hope that is seen is not hope, for who hopes for what he sees. But if we hope for what we do not see, we wait for it with patience. The author is saying that the Christian has hope, but hope means that we don't have it yet. It's not in our hands, it's in the future. Our inheritance is yet to come. By God's mercy, yes, we get some pleasure now, but most of our joy is out in the future. What Jesus promised is suffering in this life and eternal joy in the life to come. So let me ask you a question, brothers and sisters. the Christian life without suffering? Are you trying to live a life of comfort? A life of luxury? Are you trying to follow Jesus but not give up anything? Avoid all the pain? If so, you're not living the way that your Savior lived? If so, you're not living the way that he called his disciples to live? Are you surprised when you face pain? Do you get angry with God when you suffer, whether it's from a broken body or broken people or a broken situation? Do you recoil from the opportunity to make a sacrifice for the mission of Jesus to take the gospel to the world? Dad's in the house. When it comes time in the evening, are you resentful of the opportunity to give up what you're doing and to go in and read a Bible story and pray with your kids before they go to sleep. Moms on Sunday mornings, when you have to get those kids out of bed early to come to Peace Church at 8 a.m. or 9.30 a.m. or 11 a.m., I know it's extremely hard, but do you resent that suffering in order to bring your family to church? Teens, when you go to school and you have that opportunity to look different from your friends, when you know it's going to cause you pain and shame, do you take that opportunity or do you just go the way of the world that doesn't follow Jesus? Jesus says, take up your cross and follow me. 2. The world vs. your soul (vv. 36-37) Number two, the second comparison we have, the world or your soul take a look at verses 36 and 37 with me For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world and forfeit his soul for what can a man give in return? for his soul So I think the second step here Jesus plays out a scenario he says alright if you chase the world And if you succeed if you gain the world is it worth it What advantage is it if you get the entire world, but you lose your soul? Like in verse 37 he plays out what happens if he gets to the end of your life You've you've lived your whole life. You've you've done all the things. You 've gone the path of the world and you've gained the whole world at the end of your life. Can you trade all the money, all the goods, all the stuff, all the experiences, all the pleasures of the world for your soul? No. Wrong currency. I love our country. I love getting to celebrate July 4. We had an awesome week this past week. I'm so thankful for the men and women who sacrifice and serve to protect us. I'm thankful for the freedoms we have. I'm thankful for the way that we try to offer the American dream. We try to offer that if you work hard you can earn a better life at least temporarily in this world. I love all those things and yet also brothers and sisters You got to know you got to remember the American dream is not what a disciple of Jesus dreams about, hopes for. The disciples dream is not for earthly treasure, it's for heavenly treasure. Unfortunately in our country, and our country is pretty much exclusively where they come from, there are people who preach another gospel. It's often called the prosperity gospel. There are preachers, pastors, who have large followings, who have books, who have podcasts, who you can listen to online, that will tell you that if you just follow Jesus, you will always be healthy, you'll be healed from whatever's going on, you'll have you'll always have the money that you need. If you just ask for specifically what you need, God will always make you happy, make you healthy, make you prosperous. That stuff is out there and it's very popular, but you gotta know, I don't like to criticize other preachers, we don't make a habit of doing that at Peace Church, but you gotta understand that if you're listening to that during the week, that's the opposite of what you're gonna hear on Sunday. That's the opposite of what you're hearing this morning, that's the opposite of what Jesus says right here. Jesus doesn't say, I promise that if you follow me, everything will be great. He says, I promise if you follow me, you will suffer. The gospel isn't about gaining the world. The gospel is about gaining Christ.Think of passages like Philippians 3 verse 8 the Apostle Paul Who suffered much says indeed I count everything as loss Because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my lord for his sake I have suffered the loss of all things. I count them as rubbish in order that I might gain Christ the world's goods I count them as Christ The world's goods I count them as garbage in order that I would have Christ That's the disciples dream One of my favorite Preachers is a guy named John Piper and one of his most famous illustrations that is getting older now And so maybe we haven't heard it often enough. I want to share it with you. He gives an illustration of it's called the seashells illustration. He tells a story from the 1998 readers digest of a couple The title of the piece was start now retire early He tells the story of an older couple named bob and penny in their 50s that they saved up their money and they retired early And they got to move to florida and now they spend all their time Trolling out in the out in the sea and their 30-foot trawler and they collect shells on the beach and he poses the question when they stand before Jesus what will they have to show him look Lord look at my shells look at my boat that is a tragedy that is a life wasted I'm not saying there's anything wrong with having a good job I'm not saying there's anything wrong with saving for retirement. But if your hope, if your dream, retire early, collect shells, you might be wasting your life. In the words of Jim Elliot, missionary who died at the end of a spear trying to share the gospel, he said, he is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. Friends, are you chasing the world? Or are you chasing a life that will mean something for eternity? The upside down way of the cross looks crazy now. It looks like a waste now, but it's the only thing that will matter for eternity. 3. Shame before God vs. Shame before people (v. 38) Number three third comparison that Jesus gives us shame before God or Shame before people take a look with me at verse 38 For whoever is ashamed of me and my words in this adulterous and sinful generation of him Will a son of man also be ashamed when he comes in the glory of his father with the holy angels." So Jesus takes the same question he poses it in a little bit different way. Whose disapproval do you fear the most? Will it be the world's or will it be God's? I think Jesus makes it pretty clear which one we should choose. He holds out that comparison. He says this adulterous and sinful generation versus he says Jesus, the son of God coming in the glory of his father with his holy angels. Which one of those two things will you fear the most? Which of those two groups will you seek to please throughout the course of your life? The original 12 disciples had to face that choice many times. Peter, the night Jesus is betrayed, he faces three opportunities to either claim that he follows Jesus or deny Jesus. Unfortunately, Peter denies Jesus three times because he's afraid of what might happen to him. The rest of the disciples on that same night, Jesus gets arrested, what do they do? They all run, they scatter, they disappear. Fortunately, we've got a story in Acts chapter four where things get a little bit better. Peter and John, they're preaching the gospel, they get arrested, they get imprisoned, they get released and they get told, if you preach Jesus' name again, we're gonna do the same thing to you again. And they say, we don't care, we're gonna go and we're gonna preach. The Lord had been working in their hearts and they weren't afraid anymore, but they faced that question, will I fear man or will I fear God? Who do I want to please the most? The answer might seem obvious sitting here right now, but what will you do this week? Who will appear bigger in your mind, God or people? The fear of man has a lot of different names. Peer pressure is one of them. The pressure from your peers to do a certain thing, it starts really early. Recently, my wife and I got to watch one of our daughters and her soccer team sitting around talking and you know those Stanley mugs that are really popular that everybody has I didn't know apparently nine-year-old girls already no brand names because one young lady looked at another young lady and started making fun of her because she had a knockoff Stanley mug it wasn't Stanley it was I don't know something else peer pressure starts early. It's another name for the fear of man who do you want to please whose disapproval do you fear are. Are you constantly over committed? Do you have a hard time saying no? People might really love you, but that's something we also call being a people pleaser It means that you're not able to balance a healthy life a healthy schedule because you always want to make other people happy Now that might make a lot of people happy, but it also presents a danger one faced with the choice Will you please the Lord will you please God? Do you ever tell lies? Even little minor exaggerations? Why do we do that? Because we don't want to get in trouble for something or because we want to look really good. We want to impress people. All of these things are signs of the fear of man, as the Bible calls it. And Jesus knows us. Jesus knows that all of us have a tendency to fear people, to want to please people. And so, at the end of this call to discipleship, he says, he calls that out. He says, you're going to face that. You need to make a decision now. Will you fear man or will you fear God? Disciples of Jesus would rather be shamed before man than before their Father in heaven. You see, when the Holy Spirit is at work in your life, when you have spiritual eyes to open, you realize that my way is actually the one that's upside down. That Jesus' way is actually the way that is right. That my way leads to death, that Jesus' way leads to life. That the upside down way of the cross looks crazy in this temporary, so short life, but for all of eternity, the way of the cross is what will make sense. For all of eternity, we're gonna sit there and say, well, yeah, that's the way all of us should have lived. It's the way of the cross. I don't want to look back and regret the moments that I went the other way. Brothers and sisters, my prayer for you this morning is that the Holy Spirit would open the eyes of your heart, that you would desire the way of the cross. the eyes of your heart, that you would desire the way of the cross. Would you please stand with me and let's pray to close.